There is a sizeable community of raw vegans near where I live and these folks are hard core.
This is easy to understand as those who embark on a raw vegan diet typically feel fantastic for quite some time while eating this way. For several months or even a year or two, increased energy, clear skin and resistance to infection may be observed.
Is this because a raw vegan diet is the right way to eat long term?
Far from it.
A raw vegan diet is really a cleansing diet which helps to detoxify the body, not nourish the body.
The raw, whole foods that vegans consume are certainly a huge leap forward from conventional processed foods and anyone would initially feel better eating raw vegan if he/she had been eating the Standard American Diet previously.
Over time, as the body becomes depleted of minerals, serious health issues start to emerge if raw veganism is continued.
This is because the fat soluble activators A, D, and K2 – only found in animal foods – supercharge mineral absorption and without these critical nutrients in the diet, mineral depletion and ill health is the inevitable result.
The bottom line? You can eat loads of mineral rich foods as a raw vegan and still be mineral starved.
Watch this 3 minute video below where Maria, a former raw vegan and the creator of the Green Smoothie Challenge discusses her abrupt conversion to nutrient dense animal foods due to the health and tooth challenges she experienced after two years as a raw vegan. Her vegan catharsis came after reading Rami Nagel’s book Cure Tooth Decay.
You will be shocked how rapidly her health challenges resolved after she began to consume nutrient dense animal foods such as cod liver oil, raw butter, and organ meats.
If you know any vegans, please forward this video (anyone know President Clinton’s email address??). Folks who follow veganism are in serious denial about how this way of eating is going to eventually destroy their health if it hasn’t already and a testimonial from a former hard core vegan may be just what they need to realize that humans are not designed to subsist purely on plant foods.
Sarah, TheHealthyHomeEconomist.com
|
|
{ 148 comments… read them below or add one }
Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health — The Healthy Home Economist http://t.co/64UESqX0
My questions are:
Maria said she was ‘a 95% raw vegan’. Well thats like me saying I perform 95% with no drugs… WTF!! lol!
How come this Maria chick has a gut and not in any shape but she is the ‘authority’ after a year on her 95% raw vegan ‘diet’. LMAO!
How come ALL the anti vegan snake oil sellers out there sell MINERAL SUPPS to their meat based diet followers??
How come Sally Fallon is writing a new book called ‘Fat Bitch’ in response to vegan author Rory Freeman’s NYC times best seller ‘Skinny Bitch’.?
How come Mary Enig looks like death warmed up. Check out Mimi Kirk and she is about 10 years older lol!
The fat you eat is the fat you wear…
Sarah looks good. Maria is recovering from raw veganism. I think some respond better to meats and others to vegetables.
Did you see this article says that you only get Vitamin A and D via eating dead animal flesh?
/facepalm.
If vegans are so healthy, why are so many of them obese?
Because vegans come in all shapes and sizes. Not all vegan food is health food. There is plenty of vegan junk food… chips, fries, faux meats, cakes, cupcakes. Just because it’s vegan doesn’t mean it won’t make you fat.
@durianrider- You never saw past the curve of her bust line, how can you say she has a gut???
Also, she was saying that she at a vegan diet that was 95% raw, not that she was 95% vegan. She was also a vegan for upwards of 2 years, not one.
One more thought- you do realize that our “ultra-skinny super model ideal” is fake, right? We’re not designed to look like walking toothpicks…
For us, its all about balance. To much one way or the other is never good:)
Thanks for sharing the video! It is great to see people who used to promote raw vegan diets come to realization that such diet is only a cleansing diet, and not to be used for building and maitaining your health! And Maria is so open minded to try organ foods right away!
I am having liver and onions for lunch today, since I found that when I have liver at least once a week, it gives me
great energy. My lab work for iron and B12 needs work
marina\’s last post: Peach pie, gluten free
“So eat always from the table of God: the fruits of the trees, the grain and grasses of the field, the milk of beasts, and the honey of bees. For everything beyond these is of Satan” ~Jesus http://www.tinyurl.com/gospeac
reference please?
I was a vegan in my twenties and felt great but, at about two years I started going down fast and getting ill. Upon going to my Doctor he advised me to eat some meat moderatly because it had minerals in it I needed to process others properly. Once I taught myself to eat meat again I started feeling better within a month. I now eat quality premium meats a couple of times a week. I actually now live on a small farm and raise my own. Thank you for posting this because I have been telling my daughter about this and what happened to me years ago as she is now 30 and a total vegan. I am sharing this for her to read and watch
to the lady with the 30 year old vegan daughter who was vegan herself in her 20s
Not disrespect but I find it odd that you would listen to a doctor of all people who have next to no education in nutrition and often know less than the average person interested in nutrition and health.
I feel maybe you were cleansing too rapidly and that is why experience raw fooders like Dr Norman Walker who lived to be 97 knew that people need transitional diets to go back and forth to to slow cleansing if it is too fast and causing healing crises.
Also at 20, your vegan diet may not have had optimal choices and you may not have known what you might now as to what to eat..
You may feel fine now but one can achieve a level of health like the waitress that I spoke of before..she thought she was super healthy before she began Ehret’s diet but she had no clue people could be that healthy as in face few are. You may be healthy but you might be super healthy on an optimal raw vegan diet whole food with lots of green smoothies
see my long post below. also watch the film forks over knives with your daughter for some scientific backing for a plant based diet. You can download it at torrentz
This is one lady’s experience. Look into the work of Dr. Esselstyn of Cleveland Clinic or Dr. Campbell of Cornell and many others who advocate and live out a plant based diet. And these men are in their 70′s and still thriving off such diets. A great documentary to watch is Fork over Knives (available on Netflix and other sources) This lady could of had other health issues as well that would have come up no matter what.
Love that film and many other live healthy on a plant based diet and ,most of these diets contain high raw.
this can be watched for free on download at torrentz for those who have no access to it.
I also like food inc and fat, sick and nearly dead which are there too.
I just found out a rec center in my area is showing the film and a few days later Dr Esselstyn will be speaking there. I am hoping to go.
Food, Inc. is against soybeans and all for local meats!
Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health — The Healthy Home Economist http://t.co/Ogrd5Xbv
Forks over Knives is an excellent Doc. One of my Fav’s. I have watched all of the Food Documentaries and it is about balance, and eating healthy foods raised properly, and without chemicals.
Carve out a little time to read this informative, hilarious and thorough critique of Forks Over Knives:
http://rawfoodsos.com/2011/09/22/forks-over-knives-is-the-science-legit-a-review\
-and-critique/
Thanks for sharing. Last summer – I did a 1 month green smoothie cleanse. After the cleanse I had a cough that lasted six months and was deep and would not go away. It took alot of time to heal from that and I think that a month on green smoothies did more damage than it healed.
I would need some kind of proof that your green cleanse was the cause of your cough. An infection or cough can be caused by a variety of virus’ or infection.
I don’t think Noelle was saying that the green smoothie fast caused her cough. I would assume from what she said that while being on the green smoothie fast she had a health crisis because her immune system was compromised from being on the green smoothie fast. My assumption was that the whole event was atypical for her, which is what lead her to believe it was suspiciously connected to the smoothie fast. I would have assumed the same thing were it a type and duration of illness that was not customary for me.
I think you’re right, Sarah, with your statement which says something to the effect of raw vegans NOT changing their ways. They won’t. You get people like Mikey Adams touting raw veganism and everything else raw (except milk – he doesn’t use dairy products, of course, even though they are best used raw) and people buy it hook, line and sinker. Even smart people like former Pres. Clinton, as you pointed out. I saw a photo of him recently – he looks terrible and to me he seems to have aged a lot in the past year. Of course, he’s not getting any younger, but I think some of it or maybe a lot of it has to do with his newly adopted eating habit. I’m pretty sure the poor dude is on probably 3 – 4 medications, too. It’s a set-up for disaster.
I have a friend who keeps asking me if cooking foods diminishes the nutritional value. I’ve done the best I can to explain it to her, but if you have something I could add I’d be grateful. She’s convinced that if she makes beef vegetable soup she should not let it simmer for hours because the nutrition will be gone. Arrggghh.
Yes, President Clinton looks absolutely awful. From Dunkin Donuts to veganism. From the frying pan into the fire basically.
Sarah, TheHealthyHomeEconomist\’s last post: Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health
After all of his heart troubles, I don’t think LOOKS were what was most important to him. He says he FEELS tons better, with more energy and mental clarity, etc. THAT’S what is most important, over LOOKS. How unkind to even mention that.
@ Dawn: I haven’t heard him say a WORD about how he feels. And yes, looks are always a telltale sign of how he really feels. Those suitcases under his eyes are unmistakeable. I was not being unkind, I was being truthful. If you can’t stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen.
The pictures I saw he looks great and younger. And the reason he went on it is to help him not rebuild plague and help his heart disease and the vegan diet is very good for that.
Another thing of help to reverse plague is (organic) cayenne (as hot as you can take it–preferably in the form of tincture or tea (use distilled water for all teas) and raw garlic (must be raw -3 or more cloves a day) which together reverse plague. Also take organic ginger tincture for the capillaries.
He is not a raw foodist to my knowledge and he very rarely does eat fish not e says not often
@Dawn – Because the way you look on the OUTSIDE usually reflects how you feel and what your health is on the INSIDE. The comment about his looks was not about the cosmetic or attractiveness of him! It was about how his unhealthy appearance is most likely due to the fact that he isn’t healthy on the inside.
I agree, and have noticed many times that as true, hardcore vegans age they have a cadaverous look to them – too thin, pale, pasty, and wrinkly. Your skin and hair need those fats! Nothing like the traditional diet for a healthy, happy glow!
I get that question a lot about cooking food–I’m an acupuncturist. I tell my patients that when they have a weak digestive system (and almost everyone in the US does), cooking their food lets it rest more. If the food isn’t cooked, then the stomach has to do all the work that you are doing on the stove. Also, the Chinese do a lot of soups and stews because when you cook something in water, the nutrients go in the water–particularly when you are simmering on low heat and don’t have a lot of steam (which may release nutrients into the air) the nutrients stay in the broth. Soup is WONDERFUL!
I love this article in that it talks about what good a vegan diet can do (cleanse) because we need to hear both sides of things. Many bodies do need more cleansing and releasing while others (most of ours) need tonifying (nutrients). Some people can get away with cleansing for longer periods but others find it too much even for shorter periods. As someone who talks about balance and individual bodies, I appreciate when someone allows me to explain why someone else may be getting great results and I’m telling my patient to do something different.
Bonnie\’s last post: How Are Acupuncturists Like Writers?
Do some reading on enzymes. Cooked food is devoid of enzymes because the temperature of cooking destroys them. They are vital for digestion and proper nutrition. If you eat only cooked food, your body must provide enzymes, which puts tremendous strain on the pancreas and other organs, and leads to disease. Eat some raw food before or with every meal. How many animals cook their food? You are an animal too.
The level of ignorance in this thread is abysmal, starting with the original article. Please people – find better sources of information. Unless you’re just looking for someone to tell you what you want to hear about that ‘horrible raw veganism’ – then this is perfect for you. This author obviously has an ax to grind (as stated in the first line – “There is a sizeable community of raw vegans near where I live”), and doesn’t know much of anything. Disregard and move on.
Many eaters of traditional diets eat a lot of raw, lacto-fermented vegetables. We include them in our diet every day.
Barbara – I thought Forks over Knives was about being a vegetarian? Am I wrong?
Tina, Yes, I was simply agreeing that is was a good food documentary. If one chooses to have a total plant food base diet that is great. I think people should know that some of us that took that route had to go back to meat. My own body was having trouble asborbing enough amino acids, minerals etc from just plants for my body to absorb all the vitamins and minerals it needed.
PEACE!
“So eat always from the table of God: the fruits of the trees, the grain and grasses of the field, the milk of beasts, and the honey of bees. For everything beyond these is of Satan”
…there is no Biblical scripture that says this..This phrase is from The Essene Gospel of Peace, Book One that talks about worshipping “mother earth” intepreted and held by the Vatican
Christ ate lamb or goat to keep the Passover and we also know he ate fish..
I would wager that the meats back then were far different than the ones we have now even organic due to the environment.
The Bible does say I give you herbs for your food and plants for your medicine
In Genesis it said plants shall be as meat for us and not until after the flood did he allow for meat due to lack of vegetation.
Not co-incidentally perhaps the ages went for the 900s to the 100s and under.
Jesus was respectful to his mother and gracious to the host and would have eaten the foods she prepared which in all likelihood were the foods of the average Jewish person of the day; however, I once read they were of the essence sect where primarily vegetarian was used.
Just cause he occasionally ate clean, organic animals food does not mean necessarily that this was his steady diet. Jesus was more focused perhaps on the spiritual lessons to us than the physical ones but I can guess he would not be advocating for using gmo and refined and irradiated foods and fast foods etc were he alive today.
Actually the real historical Jesus taught that animal sacrifice and eating meat was edited into the Torah (FYI I am Jewish also btw). We Jews who are educated on Torah matters are well aware that Hashem never required animal sacrifice and that it was edited in later (See Jeremiah 8:8)
In fact the Ben Asher Torah Codex has Hashem clearly forbidding the eating of Meat to Moses unlike modern edited Bibles.
Jesus did infact teach a LIVING FOODS VEGETARIAN DIET according to the Essene Gospel of Peace which was locked in Secret Vatican Archives until the 1930′s. The Clementine Homilies also supports this. (Church history also records that the earliest followers of Jesus including his brothers and the Apostles were all vegetarians!)
Of course you can imagine if you think about it why Christianity covers up the fact that animal sacrifice was never required also!
(Folks go read the Dead Sea Scrolls, Paul of Tarsus was in fact the ENEMY of the Jesus movement!)
very interesting discussion!
Bob, if you are Jewish, have you heard of Sid Roth? ( check out http://www.sidroth.org )
-becky
I will pray for you and the lies you believe about the old and new covenant. This website is about food as is the comment section so I will not comment any further. In Christ, Sara
Here is a good read, I though to share this with you. May it be a blessing.~Cor 4:3-4 http://www.bartleby.com/108/47/4.html
Absolutely- there is a reason that a raw vegan diet (like the Gerson therapy) is recommended to people when they have cancer (as in tumors, not blood cancers)- it’s to radically clean the body and starve the underlying parasites that are causing the problem. However, it IS a starving diet, a cleaning diet, and it will not build health at all. It is a tool to be used when needed and then allow a quick return to nourishing, traditional foods, rich in animal proteins and fats (from healthy pastured animals) to rebuild the body and nourish it for life.
When I was so desperate to improve my health, I went to a raw vegan diet because I’d found books that spoke what I knew to be true- that the Standard American Diet was killing me. However, it really went off the rails when it discussed that animal products were the problem- no CONVENTIONAL animal products were the problem. Cooking was not the problem, but consuming every COOKED and FRIED like most modern diets include, without FERMENTED live foods, inclusion of fruits and veggies on the diet (more than corn and potato). Anyway, I didn’t know about Nourishing Traditions then and my husband and I went raw vegan for a few months- and it was horrible. I didn’t feel well, there was too much agave nectar in our diet, and nothing was warm or satisfying. It felt so unnatural, so soul-less. After all, we’ve been gathering around the campfire cooking meat for a really, really long time- millions of years- and this just eating salad and zucchini noodles and nut butters and superfood shakes really goes against that.
Long story short, it was through my foray into a vegan diet (raw vegan!) that brought me to Nourishing Traditions and once I read the first 60 pages, I knew I was home. It was truth that shook me to my core, and it was literally what saved my life. Real, traditional foods are healing and nourishing and it’s exactly what we’re supposed to eat for lifelong health.
Amy Love @ Real Food Whole Health\’s last post: Fresh Bites Friday September 30, 2011
Dean Wiebe- that’s not in the Bible. Jesus never said that.
Funny this came up today as I am starting a fast today to try and cleanes out the years of asthma meds I’ve been on. You can bet I’ll be going back to my NT diet after I break it! In spite of being on this diet for 5 years now I still have those rigid lines in my nails and some asthma Sure would like to see these go away eventually!
I was wondering why Bill Clinton was looking so bad. I didn’t realize he was eating raw vegan.
He’s not. He’s eating a vegan diet. There’s a difference.
There may be a difference, but he’s apparently not including any animal foods in this diet and it shows.
I
10 bucks says Bill Clinton is eating The Standard Vegan Diet of processed meat replacements, too much pasta, and too many refined grains. That’s not a healthy diet for anyone, and certainly not for a vegan. That’s not whole foods vegan eating. And it doesn’t prove anything about eating or not eating meat.
Denise Minger wrote a wonderful critique/commentary/debunking of “Forks Over Knives.”
I read Denise Minger’s “critique” – she has trouble, IMPO, deciding which side of the fence she REALLLLLLY wants to be on. She supports veganism, basically, but at the same time supports animal foods. IOW, she supports eating the way it should be. But people aren’t getting that take-home message, especially if they only read the first few paragraphs, which a LOT of people do. They skim and don’t get into the heart of the article, and I’ve had a couple of people say “hey, I think she’s changed her mind about an animal based diet. At least that’s the way I read it. She’s very supportive of the vegan crowd. Not much of a critique if you ask me”. Well, mmmm – k. When I read it I sorta got the same feeling. She didn’t want to step on toes and she didn’t.
She doesn’t have any trouble with anything. I have no idea where you got that impression. It’s clear to me that she supports truth and honesty above all else, and goes where the science takes her. Thousands of outraged vegan toes were stepped on, to the point where she was denounced across the entire net as an imaginary creation of WAPF, a paid shill for the meat industry, you name it. She produced the best critique of The China Study since Chris Masterjohn’s, along with numerous follow ups until Colin Campbell slunk off with his tail between his legs. Her takedown of Forks Over Knives is just as rigorously constructed. I look forward with great interest to her upcoming book dismantling the USDA dietary recommendations.
@damaged justice: Then you need to reread the article. She falls all over herself basically apologizing to the vegan community. She says “I kind of loved this movie” and a lot of people stopped reading right there, or at least the people I talked to because they thought she was in favor of veganism. I tried to explain that they should keep reading.
I, too, look forward to her dismanteling the USDA. But her style better change because people are getting the wrong impression of her “critiques”.
Either you have a different opinion, or you’re the who who “needs to reread the article”.
And if people “skim and don’t get into the heart of the article”, that’s no fault of Denise Minger, but the fault of a lazy reader.
Though I do agree with the pitfalls of strict veganism, I really do wish everyone would spend MORE time and effort educating people of the dangers of eating the meat that over 90% of the population consume! I know that this site and many others DO promote sourcing meat from local farmers that pasture their animals and feed them the kind of food that God intended. However, why are all of these blogs and sites spending more time bashing vegans instead of speaking out to those that eat all this poisoned, unsustainable meat from large agra farms?
There seems to be the assumption that, of course, EVERYONE does or can afford to eat the “good” meat. WRONG!! The dairy that I source my raw milk sells beef and chicken. The beef is super expensive and they only sell their chickens once a year in the early fall.
I don’t mind pointing out the pitfalls of veganism, but seriously folks….you’re only preaching to about 1-2% of the population. We should be shouting from the rooftops daily about the current state of our poisoned meat and the unsustainable way that these animals are raised!
Please!!! Start preaching about things that the meat eaters need to hear too! (sorry, I don’t mean to sound like I’m shouting, but I’m really passionate about this subject!)
I’m sure Sarah has posted before about eating local pastured meats, local raw dairy, pastured eggs, etc. I think the basic idea is not to eat SAD but eat cleanly. I know some eat vegetarian for religious reasons and that diet can be healthy but I can’t imagine a vegan diet being healthy other than short-term. There are just too many things missing there. One argument that always resonated with me is that there are no traditional cultures that have survived while eating a vegan diet. Nuff said.
Magda\’s last post: Fall is here…
NOT enough said. I agree that strict veganism can be unhealthy for the long term. I am NOT a vegan.
My point is….I think every time that someone bashes veganism (less than 2% of the population) they should also add how detrimental eating factory farmed meat is to our bodies. That would actually reach over 90% of the population.
Hmmmm…..try to enlighten 1-2% of the population or 90% of the population??? Sounds like a no-brainer to me!
I think Sarah tries to enlighten everyone. She may come over as ‘blunt’ but she always has research to back things up. I don’t think she honestly meant to bash 2% of the population. She was just responding to something that happened in her community…
Magda\’s last post: Fall is here…
Hi Shari – You mention in a later post that you wish someone would reply to this post, so I will oblige you.
Have you read most of the posts on this blog? Not ALL of the posts address negative aspects of vegetarianism/veganism. In fact, I would guess that it’s only about 2% of the posts. (The posts, not the comments made by others). By your reasoning, that would be exactly right. Sarah blogs about a huge range of health-related topics, including factory-farmed meats, risks of vaccinations, organic gardening challenges, exercise plans, benefits of cod liver oil and, my personal favorite, the dramatic, positive effects of a traditional, nourishing diet on the behavior of a friend’s children (wink, wink, Sarah).
You say you really do wish people would spend MORE time and effort education people about the dangers of eating factory farmed meat. I read this blog every day that I am able and I would NOT do so if 90% of the posts were about factory farmed meat.
I would also suggest that people who don’t care about ingesting factory farmed meat (or organic vs. conventional foods, or vegan vs. vegetarian vs. animal-based diets) do not visit this site more than once, anyway.
So – try to enlighten 2% or 90%? A no-brainer? This blog has the capacity to reach 100% of the population. But it’s just a blog. Maybe we need an ad on during the Super Bowl, explaining the dangers of factory farmed meats. Perhaps you could start a daily blog to raise funds in support of that effort ($3 million to reach 111 million people for 30 seconds). Unfortunately, you would only be reaching about 30% of the population. Also, noone would read that blog.
Finally, thehealthyhomeeconomist.com has reached me and my family – a mere 1/777% of the population. Her blog has improved the quality of the lives of myself, my husband and my children. For that, I am incredibly grateful. I hope she does not heed your request to change her blog to suit you. It suits us just fine.
Amen! I am so tired of all the vegan bashing that appears on NT and Paleo blogs. It is such a very, very small portion of the population (raw vegan is even more rare). At the same time so little is said to the millions and millions who are eating factory farmed meats. Most of these blogs do mention that eating 100% pastured beef and pastured pork and chicken is optimal, but they don’t spend much time discussing very real dangers of eating conventionally produced meats. Personally, if I truly couldn’t afford local, pastured meats, I’d go vegetarian and use my food budget to get the best quality eggs, dairy, fruits and veggies I could find. IMO it would be far healthier than eating meats which were unnaturally forced to eat GMO grains and a steady diet of antibiotics.
Sending that video to vegan friends will not sway them; it will only serve to annoy them and leave them less open to seeing the positive changes you are making in your own life. If I sent you a video from a former NT follower who has decided that NT had ruined her health and she now eats a vegan diet would you be swayed? Exactly.
Let’s stop the vegan bashing and focus instead on sharing the importance of eating truly naturally produced whole foods with the millions and millions of people who are still buying their meats from the local supercenter.
It is not “bashing” any individual to point out that their science and logic are sorely lacking.
Also, while pastured meat is more healthful and sustainable, as well as more affordable than most people think: All other things being equal, someone who simply avoids the neolithic agents of disease will still enjoy better health on average than someone who does not.
Industrially produced meats *are* a neolithic agent of disease. Cows were never meant to eat grains–and certainly not the GMO grains they are fed in feed lots. Pigs and chickens were never meant to live their entire lives confined to the indoors eating only GMO grains.
I stand by my statement, while defining “neolithic agents of disease” as grains, legumes, sweeteners and “vegetable” oils.
It may be a very small portion of the population that eats a vegan or raw vegan diet- but it is held up in the mainstream media and society as the “optimal” diet to strive for. That is why people argue against it. Not because so many are eating that way- but because so many are touting the so-called “positive” benefits.
Thank you for this post! I have wondered how I can talk to my raw friends about their diet so thank you Maria. I went to check out her website and I was disappointed to see that she does not say any of this on thegreensmoothiechallenge.com. She does mention it is a cleansing diet but doesn’t say anything about the need for animal fats. I hope she is brave enough to communicate this message on her website!!
I also experimented with meatless and vegetarian diets in different parts of my life, and my health always deteriorated. I talk to countless clients who have had a similar experience of feeling great initially on the raw vegan diet, but that over time experience a sharp decline in health due to a lack of healthy fats and proteins which supply the fat-soluble vitamins desperately needed by the body to absorb many nutrients. I’m grateful for everyone who blogs about this subject and gives testimonials to how going back to an animal-product based diet can save health.
Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health — The Healthy Home Economist http://t.co/JMYGaJeq
This is great, just shared.
This post, I must say, is very sad. It’s a testimony to the denial and guilt that meat eaters have, always looking for a way to justify the violent destruction of life and our ecosystem for the tastes they crave. Well, I’m not letting you get away with it. Meat and animal food is an addiction, which only leads to disease in the body. This has been proven over and again by so many researchers, many of whom TODAY are CURING cancer, heart disease, diabetes, and many other chronic diseases with raw veganism. Eyeballs? Organs? Blood? For healthy teeth? Come on, people. Does it really make sense to you that in order to absorb the fat soluble vitamins in fruits and veggies, you have to eat organs, blood, etc.? Tell that to the largest, strongest animals in the world…who are not just vegetarians but also vegans. Or, you might try telling Dr. Atkins, the founder of the famous diet with his name….but…oops, you can’t…because he died of heart disease!
Dr. Atkins did not die of heart disease. I get so sick of seeing this statement from people who don’t bother to find out the truth.
Preach whatever way of eating you want, but I’m thinking that limiting ourselves to just one way of eating is not going to stand us in good stead at some point.
If you people who lean to veganism or vegetarianism think you can get by without animal fats and such, do so. But stop acting like it’s the only way to eat a “clean” diet. I also hate that term because to the veggie people it means only to eat veggies is a clean diet and to eat animal sourced foods are not clean. That’s a load of hooey.
I choose to eat a varied diet because I think it’s much more healthy for my body. Also, my DH and I eat seasonally, too. That includes meats as well as veggies and fruits. I don’t can much food anymore because our kids are gone and it’s just DH and me, but I freeze quite a bit of food (prepared) because of our weird schedules.
Here’s a link with some information about seasonal eating:
http://www.sustainabletable.org/shop/seasonal/
Dr. Atkins died from a traumatic brain injury when he slipped and fell on ice, not from heart disease. You might try fact checking before you pass around another urban legend (and use it as the crux of your argument).
I’d like to see the evidence/research where you can prove that people are curing cancer, heart disease, diabetes etc… with veganism. Let’s see the facts.
You don’t have to eat organs and blood to absorb the fat soluble vitamins……you need…….fat.
Animals that are herbivores have a different make-up than humans. We were designed to be omnivores. For example – Cows have 4 chambers in their stomach to process the grasses they eat. The grasses are indigestible to them until their specialized stomach process it.
Humans can’t do that. So, you can’t say that because all a cow needs is raw plant food (grass), then by definition all humans need is raw plant food too. That type of reasoning just doesn’t work.
Humans and animals have similarities, sure. But to say we can all process foods the same way is simply and obviously untrue. To say otherwise is ignorant and completely dicredits you.
Thank you! This article seems to be all about bashing veganism from every angle, and is attracting the usual level of mainstream response. I agree it’s guilt-driven – people have to find excuses to justify their actions, especially when so many people are finding the nutritional wonders of a natural (aka vegan) diet. I think someday it will be common sense, as it already is for many people. In the meantime, people are very motivated to bash it and spread misinformation.
Having been a vegan for almost 20 years, I find that this kind of disinformation never stops, regardless of what facts are found. Nevertheless, it is disappointing to see the level of ignorance in the article as well as many of the comments. I especially hate to see ignorant people advising others on nutrition of all things. Readers beware.
strongest animals? Lions eat organs. In fact when they were first introduced into captivity they were unable to bread. No one could figure out why they couldn’t breed. Then the were studied in the wild, and it was discovered that they eat organs (in fact they eat them first!). Once organ meats were introduced to the lions in captivity- they were able to successfully breed! So to infer that big strong animals don’t eat organs- is just not accurate
Nicole\’s last post: Borscht
We all need to stop being so dogmatic about the the right way to eat. There is no one right way to eat. We are all different and have different needs, beliefs, etc. When we put ourselves into these boxes of vegan, paleo, macrobiotic or whatever other label that we identify with, we are limiting ourselves and those around us.
No matter what kind of diet that someone eats, you are going to find people that it works for and people that it doesn’t work for. We need to be accepting of that and find out what works for us as individuals.
I agree, Mike. I wish someone would respond to my post earlier. Everyone keeps bashing strict veganism but are not talking nearly enough about the poisoned meat that over 90% of our population eats. Factory farming needs an overhaul! Why aren’t people screaming about that?
Veganism needs to be addressed as many of our young girls are getting sucked into it and it will negatively affect their fertility and ability to bear healthy children in the future.
This is a big deal … much more than the 2% argument you talk about which makes it seem trivial. It is far from trivial.
Sarah, TheHealthyHomeEconomist\’s last post: Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health
From what I have read, the growing infertility crisis is linked with GMO foods that are in up to 90% of the foods in the store.
I feel since far more women and girls are eating these gmos foods and in fact, unless one has eaten 100% organic food for the last 15 years, we all are eating them is far more of a big deal that needs to be addressed.
Most people on a vegan diet, including young women tend to be much more knowledgeable of nutrition than the average women in America.
As someone above discussed the big problem of factory farming and eating this horrific source of meat that many people do not even think about or realize or for those unable to afford organic animal foods which in this declining economy are many.They probably would be better off going vegan and a lot of raw than continuing to eat this dangerous food seeing the filthy slaughterhouse conditions.
I spoke with a lady who was 60 years old and she said she was never taught anything about nutrition. She was in 5th stage kidney disease and in desperation trying to avoid dialysis that the doctor pushed for months, she turned to the web and found curezone, David Wolfe Dave the raw food trucker which all inspired her and so she changed her diet.
She had very little money but did not eat any animal foods and ate a lot of fresh produce like grapes and cabbage and other cruciferous veggies everyday etc, pumpkin seeds daily ands things like this–mostly just foods and one supplement–and and she reversed her kidney disease.
The doctor was so stunned he said he had never had a reversal like that in 35 years of practice. I spoke to her personally on the phone in order to get diets of her diet and posted it on curezone in the 30 steps to healing kidney disease thread if people want to know what she ate.
Here is a women who is typically even the sad diet who changed and had a miracle.How many more people like this are out there. Dave the Raw food trucker also cured his kidney disease, colon cancer, his diabetes (in 4 days) and lost 225 by eating a highly nutritious whole food, vegan, 100% raw diet.
Nearly all of our greatest natural healers were very ill and cured themselves and then many others primarily with food and herbs etc Anne Wigmore ever got sick ion this diet many decades and she helped so many dying people to heal. So did Dr Richard Schulze help hundreds of thousands who advocated a raw vegan diet for the terminal ill and incurable diseases with great success. Most of these healers used juice fasting and juices. nearly vegetarian (Dr christopher a supporter of the mucusless diet allowed once a week a little clean chicken or fish and cottage cheese. Dr Bernard Jenson (live to about 100) allowed for some veal joint broth and a few things but plant foods particularly fruits and veggies were always used in these diets that cured people of diabetes, heart disease, especially cancer etc.
On hacres.com are thousands of testimonies of incredible healings. To deprive people of that potential healing by making them afraid of the non animal diet is not fair to the sick. or even those who might prevent becoming sick.
I became a vegan 50% raw 2 plus years ago due to diabetes and all of my a1c tests in the last years have been normal (6 tests) when they were as high as 600 plus and mostly in the 300-400 range prior and I was on a diet then that was 90% vegetarian and 85% vegan consisting of free range, organic meats, wild caught fish. free-range dairy and eggs (mostly) lots of produce, whole grains. legumes and not much junk.
Having been studying nutrition or 30 years, I also have been shopping out of health food stores that long so I was not eating anything close to the SAD and still got diabetes etc. I also have hope if I can not fix my other things that I might be able to do so by tightening up the diet and going a lot more raw.
Having hope is crucial to people with serious disease and this diet and the many healings from it offer that hope to people.
I do not feel fanatical but changed due to health concerns..maybe if I am on it a long long time and feel ill I know I can always back off a little. but right now I feel confident following these great healers and people who were really sick and seeing how my body does..so far nothing negative in the 28 months I have been on it.
Why aren’t you screaming about it by doing your own blog? If this is an important issue to you, and it obviously is, then why not start a blog that features this information?
I couldn’t agree more on the boxes! People get so caught up in them that they won’t take the time to figure out what really works for their body. Everyone is not the same and some people are going to do better one diet while others do better on another. The most important thing is to get all the processed, industrial foods out of your diet. After that, it’s really just a matter of finding the optimum diet for you.
Also, the 2% number is actually way too high. Vegans are only about 1% of the population at most, and of those, far less than half are raw vegans.
I would guess even less were vegan raw foodists though it is gradually spreading. I do have a friend I meet years ago in health food store who insists she needs meat to feel healthy.
I think if one keeps the animal low and used very healthy sources and has the rest of the diet good, they may experience great health. Those refined foods are now up to 90% gmos.
The china study said that those keeping it at 10% had all the same benefits as the vegans. I do think raw may be the real key and when one is eating a high plant diet whether exclusively or not and interested in health food enough to use excellent sources, then they probably will be eating much more raw food than the general populace.
Also I would imagine in ?china in the china study they did not have gmo foods and far less processed foods in their diet as well.
WE cannot ignore the fact that some of these healthy people were eating 1-10% animal foods, all were probably eating far less processed foods than Americans and most all were probably eating a lot of produce which tends to be key in healing people and studies. Neither can we ignore the fact that most of the people in this study were eating a plant based diet.
Lots of plants particularly produce and especially green leafy veggies, lots of raw and little of the sad diet will be of help to most I would suspect.
The China Study was flawed. That has been demonstrated again and again. I agree with the idea that even 10% of the diet being quality meat from good sources can probably be enough, but folks like to be extreme, and when surrounded by other vegans, many who bash meat, a lot of folks will cave and go whole vegan out of peer pressure.
I have never understood why vegans cannot understand that a completely vegan diet for the entire planet is not sustainable. Where are all of those beans and veggies going to grow? Vegetable farming takes up space, and depletes our soils.
While I don’t think a 100% raw vegan diet is healthy, a whole foods vegan diet certainly is. Those who say otherwise don’t have all the information on the lifestyle. My sister has been a whole foods vegan for close to 15 years now, and she’s the healthiest person I know. Tons of energy, great sleep, great muscle tone, etc. etc. She doesn’t suffer from an mineral deficiencies at all. If you’re just eating greens, fruits, and veggies, well then of course you’re going to suffer nutritionally. The most important aspects of a whole foods vegan diet is the sprouting of grains, legumes, and seeds and fermenting foods. My sister always has kimchi in her fridge, along with coconut water kefir, homemade Kombucha, and Rejuvilac. These two processes ensure you get all the minerals you need and that they are in a form the body can use. She is also quite liberal in her consumption of healthy fats: virgin coconut oil, whole nuts and seeds, wholes olives, whole flaxseed, avocados, chia seeds, etc. There are 4 keys to a healthy vegan diet: 1. It must be whole foods, nothing processed; 2. Grains, seeds, legumes must be sprouted; 3. Fermented foods must be a staple, and 4: healthy fats need to be consumed in whole food form daily.
I doubt this woman really committed to those 4 tenets for any length of time. Still have doubts? Go see Robyn Openshaw at http://www.greensmoothiegirl.com who has been a 90% whole foods vegan (the only animal product she consumes is raw milk kefir) for close to 20 years.
Why not just admit that there are different ways to live an optimal healthy lifestyle? Not everyone needs animal foods to achieve ideal health and longevity.
Well, of course she’ll be healthy if she eats raw milk kefir! Raw kefir is one of the best sources fat-soluble vitamins there are!
Did I read this right? What’s the difference between ‘cocnut water kefir’ and ‘raw milk kefir’? Do they mean the same thing? Goodness knows I do not understand the fermenting process well enough.
Kefir refers to the type of culture being used, not just the end product. Kefir grains happily ferment coconut water just as well as milk. They also make a pretty decent Rejuvilac. People abstaining from dairy will substitute with coconut water.
Exactly, Ariel. We’re saying that eating a vegan (no animal products whatsoever) diet leads to poor health. A woman thriving off of raw milk kefir is not a vegan, and such an example is simply proving our point.
Emily @ Butter Believer\’s last post: Crowding Out vs. Cutting Out: What’s Best for a Real Food Transition?
“coconut water kefir” is what was said, not “raw milk kefir”. obvious difference that was so easily glided over to act knowledgeable.
this claim “A, D, and K2 – only found in animal foods” needs some major backing up. just because someone makes a post and says that does not make it true, and this post is far from enlightening and informative as most comments seem to proclaim. vitamin A & D only found in animal foods??? how uninformed are the readers here?
the vibe i’m getting is one of self-justification by seeing someone else say something they want to feel good about.. just like when some new “research” comes along and says eating pizza is good for you. yay now we can all just keep eating pizza all the time… actually it’s tomatoes that are good for you, and you’re doing it wrong.
a former raw vegan’s testimony is pretty poor evidence to point at and say “veganism BAD”, especially in conjunction with simply untrue claims about sources for particular nutrients. i don’t care what you people eat but it sounds like there’s a lack of legitimate research involved.
Please name one plant food that contains vitamins A and D.
Beta carotene found in carrots is not true vitamin A by the way. The body has to convert beta carotene to vitamin A and the process is very inefficient and if someone has any gut issues whatsoever they are likely not making the conversion at all.
Sarah, TheHealthyHomeEconomist\’s last post: Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health
You do realize that there is a broad spectrum of carotenoids that work together to generate Vitamin A, not just beta carotene? Combined together, it’s a very efficient system in the body. If you consume a wide range of dark leafy green veggies, your good to go. Go ask any biochemist to explain to you how carotenoids work.
As for plant sources of vitamin D: white mushrooms. Combine them with calcium rich leafy greens for the best absorption.
Also, you can get Vitamin D from the sun. That’s a no-brainer. All you need is 15 minutes of sun exposure. Most vegans have no problem taking a D supplement if they need to. They would rather do that than contribute to the killing or exploitation of an animal.
Just wanna point that that technically speaking, mushrooms are not plants. They’re fungus.
The raw milk kefir is not consumed daily, a few times a month at most. It’s only consumed as a natural source of B12, which the body stores very well and doesn’t need everyday. When she can’t source raw milk kefir (she DOES NOT consume it unfermented), she happily goes without. She travels a lot, so she goes without quite a bit. This is hardly the same thing as consuming meat, eggs, and dairy everyday. Most of her diet is still raw vegan.
good post Ben and thank you Roxanne for your interesting post and the 4 points. I will keep that in mind,
I have a Harsch crock but do not ferment enough and need to sprout more. I got some yeast on the top an that made me quit for a while making these fermented things.
There you are. You have admitted it! THERE ARE NO PLANT SOURCES OF B12. Clean and simple. Humans need to consume B12, you can’t get it from plants, therefore, humans are meant to eat animal products! And yes, many people require less than others, but it is still required in the human body.
It’s ridiculous to say that humans don’t need to eat animal products, but then go buy some synthetic, isolated B12 capsules and iron tablets in plastic bottles that would NEVER be found in nature, or say that when someone eats fermented milk once in a while that is somehow vegan. I fail to see how eating animal products once in a while is different then eating them every day (besides the fact that you’re consuming more nutrients. I’m talking about the moral aspect). It’s like saying: “Well, So-and-so only shoplifts once and a while, and she never steals anything too valuable. It’s not like she does it every DAY.”
Hey, I’m happy for her if she can be healthy eating very little animal products! It sounds like she does a good job eating her plant foods properly; sprouting, fermenting, lots of good fats, and the like. That’s what works for her, but it’s not going to work for most people. I don’t by any means ENJOY killing things to eat, I was actually vegetarian for several years. I’m the girl who carefully catches wolf spiders and beetles and cockroaches to let them out of the house rather than squish them, and I’ll never kill things unless I have to, but eating both animal AND plant products is how my God-given body stays vibrant and healthy.
Okay, some people here need to really look at the science. Stopping people from become healthier is not the right things to do. Yes, there are no plant based sources of B12. Where do animals get their B12? Bacteria! Where should humans be getting B12? Bacteria! Humans used to have bacteria producing B12 for them but because od changes in farming practices and many other factors we must rely on other sources of B12. Do your research before you post!
Humans ARE supposed to eat meat?!
Well, imagine that! Yes, humans are omnivores. Bon appetit!
Human are NOT omnivores! Our bodies are not meant to eat meat!
Meat-eaters: have claws
Herbivores: no claws
Humans: no claws
Meat-eaters: have no skin pores and perspire through the tongue
Herbivores: perspire through skin pores
Humans: perspire through skin pores
Meat-eaters: have sharp front teeth for tearing, with no flat molar teeth for grinding
Herbivores: no sharp front teeth, but flat rear molars for grinding
Humans: no sharp front teeth, but flat rear molars for grinding
Meat-eaters: have intestinal tract that is only 3 times their body length so that rapidly decaying meat can pass through quickly
Herbivores: have intestinal tract 10-12 times their body length.
Humans: have intestinal tract 10-12 times their body length.
Meat-eaters: have strong hydrochloric acid in stomach to digest meat
Herbivores: have stomach acid that is 20 times weaker than that of a meat-eater
Humans: have stomach acid that is 20 times weaker than that of a meat-eater
Meat-eaters: salivary glands in mouth not needed to pre-digest grains and fruits.
Herbivores: well-developed salivary glands which are necessary to pre-digest grains and fruits
Humans: well-developed salivary glands, which are necessary to pre-digest, grains and fruits
Meat-eaters: have acid saliva with no enzyme ptyalin to pre-digest grains
Herbivores: have alkaline saliva with ptyalin to pre-digest grains
Humans: have alkaline saliva with ptyalin to pre-digest grains
Based on a chart by A.D. Andrews, Fit Food for Men, (Chicago: American Hygiene Society, 1970)
Wow. Humans are not omnivores? Why do we have omnivore teeth then? You are denying the existence of what is right in your own mouth. Complete vegan brainwashing.
Thank you for this post. My new moto:
Stop the Wheat, Eat your Meat!
or eat “wheat meat”:)
Plants are passive organisms without the ability to move, think, and react (for the most part). They must employ different tactics to ensure propagation, and they generally have to rely on outside forces to spread their seed. And so various methods are “devised” to dissuade consumption long enough for the seed to get to where it’s going. Nuts have those tough shells, and grains have the toxic anti-nutrients, lectins, gluten, and phytates. They are not healthy for humans! Do your research!
I totally agree! I’ve been saying this for years. GREAT article!
Lea H @ Nourishing Treasures\’s last post: Make Your Own! Monday link-up 10/3
After watching the video I’m guessing that she made a very common raw food mistake of consuming the majority of her calories from fat. If you are raw foodist there are only 2 major sources of calories – fruit or fat. So if you are thinking you’re eating a lot of greens and not a lot of fruit – then you’re most definitely eating a lot of fat even if it’s hidden in dressings, or the added nuts, seeds, pates etc. Add your calories up in Nutridiary or DailyBurn.com and you’ll see. When you consume the majority of your calories from fat you’ll crash and burn on the raw food diet. Goto 30Bananasaday.com to learn how to do rawfood the right way!
Good luck.
-Robert
yes my fat intake went way up when I started eating 85% or so produce mainly veggies due to diabetes. It is hard to make it all palatable without dressing, raw nuts and so forth
I got Nourishing Traditions and subscribed to this site, and reluctantly began consuming local, grassfed animal products because all the arguments from your multiple sites, including yours, as well as the WAP sources, seemed to make sense. The thing is, before, as a vegetarian, I felt fine! But now after all the milk, butter, etc. I feel much worse. The problem with the NT and WAP sources is that there is no diet that suits everyone. And it gets turned in to a nasty, my-diet-is-better-than-yours full on assault. The bottom line is, consuming animal products is one way to find health, but I feel that my since-childhood aversion to meat is my body’s way of telling me to avoid it for my health. And when I do, I feel MUCH better. Trust what your body tells you, either way. We are not robots. And there are many many vegetarians and vegans who are healthy. It’s really silly and insulting to say that all people who don’t eat animals are fraile, scrawny, nutrient-starved beings. I mean, really. Once again there is a murky line between your personal opinion and researched, documented, backed up facts. I am unsubscribing. Thanks for the recipes I have been able to use.
Nothing in this post is personal opinion. It is written about, documented by pictures and lab work in the book Nutrition and Physical Degeneration.
It is very important to point out the negatives of veganism as it affects fertility and young women who are vegan for even a few years can harm their fertility permanently.
Sarah, TheHealthyHomeEconomist\’s last post: Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health
The fact that this book is published by the Weston A. Price Foundation, and it was first published over 70 years ago, sends up all kinds of red flags. Nutritional science and biochemistry has come a long way. Not to mention that the ways of going about anthropological research has changed A LOT since the early 20th century (and this book is largely based on anthropological research). When it’s endorsed by an entity like The Harvard School of Nutritional Science, then I’ll take a second look at giving it some credibility. As is stands now, I was thoroughly unimpressed. It doesn’t prove or convince me of anything.
I support you completely. Humans were not meant to eat meat (see my reply on how we are similar to herbivores and how our digestive system is clearly not meant to handle meat). We can get all our nutrients from plants and there are many credible sources supporting this. This article is a completely uninformed opinion from someone who does not know anything about nutrition and taxonomy. Here is some information on raw vegans getting vitamin A. One point, how do animals get vitamin A? FROM PLANTS!!! It’s true that the preformed active type of this vitamin is found only in animal foods. But plants are abundant in vitamin A precursors like beta-carotene. In fact, these provitamin A compounds are important enough that the USDA measures vitamin A content of foods as “retinol activity equivalents (RAE),” which includes both preformed vitamin A and the compounds that the body turns into vitamin A. There is no separate RDA or recommendation for animal-derived pre-formed vitamin A.
You can meet your vitamin A requirement for the day by drinking just one-quarter cup of carrot juice or eating a cup of kale or spinach. Other foods that make significant contributions are sweet potatoes, cantaloupe, and dark orange winter squashes, including pumpkin. A word of caution though: Earlier assessments of retinol activity equivalents in plant foods over-estimated amounts. This is because more recent data show that conversion rates of the vitamin A precursors are lower than previously believed. As a result, vitamin A is a nutrient that deserves some attention in vegan diets. This doesn’t mean you can’t get enough; it does mean that it’s a good idea to make sure you eat vitamin A rich foods every day.
Are you denying the canine teeth in your own mouth staring back at you in the mirror? WAKE UP!
Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health — The Healthy Home Economist http://t.co/m3tlrH73
Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health — The Healthy Home Economist
http://ow.ly/6M8i3
Raw Veganism May Steal Your Health — via @HealthyHomeEcon http://ow.ly/6Mqi3
I just today finished reading The Vegetarian Myth; a former hard core vegan. Great book-though I’m not a vegetarian (did it for a year about 10 years ago-didn’t like my lack of energy); I just hope I can get my vegetarian friends to read it. Hard though-they are so steadfast in their beliefs.
Good post!
oops-meant to say that the vegetarian myth was written by a former hardcore vegan…and after reading a few more of the comments above-I highly recommend it to those people-you wants facts and stats-this book has them.
Warning: Raw Veganism Will Steal Your Health — The Healthy Home Economist http://t.co/NYyXPjr8
@BoulderVegan @BSidesNarrative Have you heard of this (it is specific to raw)? MT: Raw Veganism May Steal Your Health http://t.co/2460ECoQ
Life is Always about moderation & balance RT @ActualOrganics: Raw Veganism May Steal Your Health — via @HealthyHomeEcon http://ow.ly/6Mqi3
i hate blanket statements like this. i am not a vegan, but i think a vegan diet suits some people. there are many raw foodists who are among the healthiest people around, like david wolfe. hard to deny- that guy glows! people like clinton, he probably needs some meat. i’d like to see a follow-up article on the overconsumption of meat, esp in this country, and how it affects health and the environment.
Is there an overconsumption of meat in this country? I have never heard this before… do you have any references for this? To add, there is a huge difference between consuming nitrate/nitrite laden ‘meats’ like hot dogs and bacon to consuming local grassfed meats with their fat. There is no comparison and no studies that I have seen account for this fat. The GAPS diet is based on healthy fats and meats and their broths for healing – I don’t think you can argue with Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride there…
I think vegetarian diet can be followed long-term and be health. Vegan – not long term, unless supplemented and even there I’d be careful.
Magda\’s last post: Fall is here…
Go see the website for The Harvard School of Nutritional Science. The average American consumes about 12-14 oz of meat a day, when the recommended daily intake is no more than 9 oz (2-3 three ounce portions). The average size for a steak is 8 oz. The average hamburger in a restaurant is 6-8 oz. A chicken breast is typically 6 oz. Looks like overconsumption to me.
Who recommends the 9 oz?? While I don’t know exactly what the daily intake would be, on the GAPS diet (especially intro) you would probably eat more than 12-14 anyway… For me it would be all or mostly pastured/local meats with no antibiotics, etc. Is that bad if I’m trying to heal and happen to believe in Dr NCM’s protocol? I don’t think so. Long-term I would probably scale down the meats and eat more veggies but meat and fat happen to heal the fastest.
Magda\’s last post: Fall is here…
Wow, that David Wolfe sure sells a lot of products through his site……….people like this I always distrust. They’ve turned their ‘beliefs’ into a business, instead of just teaching and sharing. I find someone like that very hard to take seriously or have much legitimacy. Is he doing it for the money or to enlighten and help people? I think he’s a clever entrepeneur.
Wow, just looking at his website now. He promotes this Longevity Warehouse? Is this his own online store? It’s very unclear. If so, this guy is definitely in it for the money. Just look at the supplements alone!! I very much doubt they are all raw and they are from so many different brands as well. That website alone tells me this guy’s not the superhero he makes himself out to be. Just cashing in on the popularity of ‘wellness’.
Plus, if you need all those supplements to stay healthy, then that’s a problem as well – that’s not a raw foodie lifestyle – that’s an eat what I want and let the supplements fill the gaps, kind of lifestyle. Definitely unhealthy. Just like a junk food eater who takes vitamins so he/she thinks they’re covered……..when in fact they are just getting sicker and sicker.
I don’t know anything about David Wolfe, but I fail to see how him promoting certain products and profiting from that promotion is any different than what is happening on many nutrition websites including this one. The so-called “Resources” page right here on this website is simply a page of ads. Sarah doesn’t suggest any resources unless she is paid to do so. I’m not saying that makes her a bad person. There is nothing wrong with wanting to get paid for the content you provide on your website, but it is silly to pretend what he is doing is any different that what Sarah is doing simply because you agree with her agenda and disagree with his.
well making money or not people like this do help a lot of people. I personally stay away form making money so the info I give is strictly from the heart and mind and people know my 50 hours a week of helping others free is not done for money.
However, Victoria Boutenko makes money and has tremendously taught and motivated me. David Wolfe motivated the lady with 5th stage kidney disease so much she gave up animals, starting eating a lot of produce and reversed her kidney disease..due to him and Dave the Rae food trucker and my posts on curezone (neither of the last two do this for any money) she was motivated and hopeful and reversed her disease.
Here is a lady who ate the SAD die for 60 year, completely unacknowledgable of everything nutrition related and I can bet you when she saw what this new lifestyle did for her healthy, you can be sure she is never going back to the sad diet
So regardless of if he makes money, I would guess he motivates and indirectly helps a lot of people as do those like Boutenko who cure themselves of serious illnesses and then research so thoroughly we can all benefit form the info in her books.
Maybe these people would not be able to devote so much time to speaking and helping and motivating etc if they had to work the regular 9-5 job.
As long as they give some help and info for free unlike people like say Kevin Trudeau or Sam Biser who are after megabucks for their info and care more for moeny than dying and sick people, I don’t care if they make some money off it ..what is more important is do they change and educate people and motivate then to eat better Are they the kind of people who if you approached them personally with an illness, would they take the time to help you.
I am sure many people do it for free before they start getting burned out and need a little something back and chose it to be in the form of income.
@ theresa: “That guy glows”. . . yeah, but you don’t know what he really eats. Just because he promotes the vegan lifestyle and sells tons of stuff on his web site, doesn’t mean that’s truly how he lives his life. Remember, this is the internet and you aren’t face to face with him either. If you live in the same town, look him up and track what he eats, otherwise take the whole deal with a grain of salt. None of us knows for positive how ANYONE else truly eats, we only know what they say they eat. Isn’t that true? It’s true of me, it’s true of you and it’s true of everyone who posts here, right?
10 bucks says Bill Clinton is eating The Standard Vegan Diet of processed meat replacements, too much white pasta, and too many refined grains. That is NOT healthy vegan eating. That’s not whole foods vegan eating.
Raw veganism…not my fav diet and here are some reasons why! http://t.co/MrusBjPq
I am waiting until my daughter is weaned and then I will start a raw vegan diet until I feel healed from some issues I’ve been having. I have never felt more alive and balanced when I go raw vegan. I am fixing issues I’ve had from 36 years of a SAD lifestyle, obesity, and thyroid issues. Once I am on the mend I will introduce my favorite- chicken broth and start a GAP style diet. I think my ethnicity (Native American, Spanish, Pacific Islander) effects the way certain foods react in me but I won’t be able to figure it out until I get more balanced. Living raw forever makes people look sickly. In my experience anyways.
There may be a time and a place for a raw vegan diet. During my own child-bearing years certainly isn’t the time for me.
Amanda\’s last post: Nettle Leaf: How to Use, Where to Buy Nettle Leaf in Bulk
A must see for people who believe that a raw vegan diet will build health. Well said. Thank you.
Sorry I don’t believe it. Victoria Boutenko who popularized green smoothies cured her family of several serious illnesses including type one diabetes which doctors say is incurable. and her son who was cured of this has been on the diet for maybe 15 years and the illness did not return.
She said many of her friends started feeling less healthy after MANY years on the diet and had to add some cooked or animal food; however, she did not want to do that and so she searched for the answer which came from her intense study of nutrition and the diet of our closest relatives the chimp who share 9.4% of our exact gene sequence and whose ability to create new words with sign language by stringing 2 or 3 together and having their own sign language in the wild and the study of their diets convinced her of the need to eat greens the most nutritious food on the planet pound for pound.
She found the best way to take the large amounts we need was via green smoothies. She added large amounts of this to her diet when she felt after 13 years of excellent health and feeling younger om a 100% raw vegan whole food diet, she and her husband began to feel older with small signs of health concerns.
After adding the green smoothie to their diet, they felt reversal and either better than when they were 100% raw. In fact, she now states she feels the green smoothies are even more important than the raw veganism. They after time did tend to eat more whole foods rather than gourmet raw vegan foods and that may have also helped them.
Others like Dr Gabriel Cousens, Dave the raw food trucker, David Wolfe etc also have improvements in health from switching to raw vegan which they still maintain..
But even common sense shows this if you believe in God. Why would we be the only animal on earth that needs our foods cooked. If so, why did nature not put stoves on trees rather than hope that man would find how to harness fire. What we need is all found in nature. Why do only our animals we fed get ill (not withstanding the damage we do to animals in the wilds with our factory farm runoff,s gm foods, chemicals, etc). why are green plants which contain chlorophyll said to resemble a human blood transfusion so prevalent in nature.
Nature shows us it is the leaves and above ground fruits and veggies we want..the fruits carry the seeds so the plants die out and animals in nature know to rotate the greens as the plant does not mind you eating some but not all as they put plant poisons like oxalic acid in spinach to force animals to rotate feedings to various types of plant lest they die.
The below the ground produce like carrots and beets etc contain more sugar and are not designed for us but to attract the microorganisms in the soil that the plants need. I do not feel God would have said in the bible I give you plants for your food and herbs for your medicine if this was not the case. Before the flood people were told to eat plants and afterwards they were permitted to eat animals as the plant life was gone and this is when they went from long long lives to much shorter ones.
People who used a raw vegan diet years ago often lived to be very old and in near perfect health such as juice originator Dr Norman Walker and Arnold Ehret Walker lived to be 97 and Ehret and his disciples achieve health beyond their wildest dreams but one must realize they were not eating all the manufactured raw vegan foods but plants as they came from the earth.
Fruits are cleansers and vegetables are builders. Were you eatign too many fruits? How about vegan store products, Also consider that even whole foods can no longer guarantee their foods do not contain gmos
It is ridiculous to think the Creator in his wisdom would create plants with a vast myriad of health benefits, nutrients, phytochemicals and things yet to be discovered but only make them be of help to us if we have a way to cook them or have access and ability to catch animals. Why would he make plants be of substanance to herbivores and give the carnivores the sharp claws and teeth and speed to catch prey but require us to have stoves or fires to survive in health.
I think maybe there is more to the picture. People like Boiutenko and family who were eating a very alkalizing diet still were not able to process beets without it turning their stool and urine reddish but after they added the green smoothies they all were able to eat beets with absolutely no color changes indicating they had reached the perfect ph.
I feel if they try to emulate her and the chimps they need to eat about 40-50% greens in the diet and this is what most animals do that are not meat eaters in the wilds.
I feel what the girl in the video experienced was too rapid cleansing causing healing crisis’s that were too intense. Generally when this happens one goes to a little cooked or animal to slow down the cleansing and then go back to the raw vegan and back and forth until the cleansing period from years of bad eating is reversed. Even Dr Walker advocated a transitional diet to proceed the change to total raw. I recall a lady doing Arnold Ehret diet thought she was in perfect health..she had been vegetarian for years and attended to her diet yet when she went to the produce diet he advocated.
She experienced things like skin softer than a baby’s. zero fatigue despite climbing big hills and standing on her feet all day as a waitress feeling as refreshed as when she arrived, personality changes everyone commented on like being so happy, so calm and peaceful etc and a host of other things. Some like Boutenko’s husband and more notably Anne Wigmore have their hair change from gray back to black..Wigmore who founded the Hippocrates Health institute, had dark non-dyed hair into her 80s and would in her profound energy run for several hours a day..they generally report needing just 2-4 hours to sleep.
oops that should have said chimps share 99.4% of our exact gene sequence in the statement I made (copied below) not 9.4% sorry
“and the diet of our closest relatives the chimp who share 9.4% of our exact gene sequence and whose ability to create new words with sign language by stringing 2 or 3 together and having their own sign language in the wild and the study of their diets convinced her of the need to eat greens the most nutritious food on the planet pound for pound.”
Chimpanzies catch members of rival tribes and eat them raw, guts and all. They’ll also eat other small amimals, and bugs.
This ‘article’ is complete bunk – there are many factors to health, such as exercise and emotional health, that could have caused her failing health, and her ‘recovery’ could have also been the result of many factors, even psychological. I have been completely vegan for almost 20 years and my health has continuously improved (vastly). Raw is even better (I am not completely raw, but 50% raw and going ever higher – all cooking does is destroy nutrients and create toxins, so raw veganism includes more nutrients!). I have never followed any diet – I merely eat colorfully (variety) and listen to my body.
The human body is not designed for animal products at all. We have the long digestive system and dull teeth of herbivores because that’s what we are. Every animal product is linked with disease and dysfunction when consumed by humans.
Educate yourself on nutrition for real, rather than following anecdotal scare stories. Record numbers of people are returning themselves and their children to vegan and vegetarian diets. As a result, there is a push to scare people back into the fold of disease and unethical treatment of animals. I highly recommend that anyone interested in this subject read John Robbins books: Food Revolution as well as the older Diet For a New America. Robbins is a man who walks his talk, and there is real science there.
I’m not sure about not being designed to eat meat at all… our digestive tracks are nowhere near the length of veg-eating animals.
As to this statement:
“Every animal product is linked with disease and dysfunction when consumed by humans.”
I think it’s just plain untrue. Read some of Dr. NCM’s research for GAPS.
While I agree that this anecdotal story is not the end-all, noone is suggesting you go on an all-meat diet, and from unhealthy animals at that. There is a happy medium.
Magda\’s last post: Fall is here…
Magda, For their size, the human digestive tract is very long, unlike all meat-eaters. When a dog ingests meat, it gets no cholesterol poisoning – dogs are carnivores. When a human eats meat, cholesterol poisoning occurs, and many other diseases as well. If you believe you’re made to eat meat, let’s see you eat a rat corpse using nothing but your teeth. Your teeth are suitable for breaking the skin of fruit at most – they will have a heck of time even breaking the skin of the rat, let alone chewing it. Not to mention you’ll vomit and find it disgusting – this is your body saying NO! Eat an apple – your body says YES! It’s just common sense.
You can think what you want about it being untrue, but disease rates are elevated with consumption of any animal products. The reason is simple – it’s the wrong fuel for the machine. The idea that veganism is some radical diet is merely the product of a twisted culture that includes all kinds of self-destructive behaviors and myths. Fruits, vegetables, nuts, seeds – this is what the human body truly thrives on. Anything else you put in it just weighs it down and causes dysfunction.
The person who had a problem with the raw vegan diet, if true, was probably simply not eating a well-balanced diet. Especially with raw vegan, a little knowledge is needed simply because new sources of food must be included. Simply eating the standard American filth diet minus animal products will be very unhealthy because you’re not balancing your diet.
I also recommend taking a quality multivitamin, especially for B12. B12 is available to vegans in a natural setting (from natural water sources, minute amounts of soil on the skin of vegetables, etc), but with modern farming practices and water treatment it is largely missing. See http://veganhealth.org/articles/everyvegan
And don’t forget the compassionate side of veganism – it feels GREAT to know one’s diet is cruelty-free. Factory farms are true horrors suffered by millions of animals everyday. Why? So you can eat unhealthy stuff posing as food.
Anyone interested in a vegan diet should read up on the basic nutrition from a reliable source, and don’t be scared by this irrational nonsense. Like I said, John Robbins has great nutritional information in Food Revolution – even for meat-eaters. We simply aren’t taught reality by most ‘experts’ and other sources of information in our culture. There are lots of people telling you all kinds of things, most of it untrue. Believe what you will – it’s your health.
“You put a baby in a crib with an apple and a rabbit. If it eats the rabbit and plays with the apple, I’ll buy you a new car.” ~Harvey Diamond
Harvey Diamond returned to eating animal products. He says that after more than two decades as a vegan he began experiencing intense cravings for red meat. He talks about this openly. The quote your reference above was written in the 1980′s and is no longer supported by him.
Harvey Diamond now says:
““I was vegetarian for over a quarter of a century, but hey, things change. I’ve always told my readers that if they crave something for a long time, it must be something the body wants or needs, so have it and see how you feel. One day out of the clear blue sky, after not having meat for twenty-five years, I started to crave a charbroiled steak the way a lion craves a wildebeest. I couldn’t get it out of my head no matter how much I tried to ignore the craving or convince myself that it was some kind of aberrant desire. So finally I decided to eat the steak, throw it up and move on. The only thing was, I enjoyed it, and I felt great.”
Heather\’s last post: Oct 6, My Green Smoothie Secret!
The problem with this story is the ALL of nothing approach. I am vegetarian on the way to vegan – and know that balancing intake is crucial of vitamins, minerals. There is chemistry at work – where calcium (like calcrate a vegetarian based calcium supplement) will only be taken up in the presence of Vitamin D (form sun or supplement and not leech bones as calcium without sufficient vitamin D does – excessive MILK/Dairy intake for instance actually helps cause osteoporosis). This smacks of meat industry propaganda to me. You can get the nutrients found in Cod Liver Oil from Rapeseed (linseed) oil. Its about Balance people. Ethical vegans search out the products that do not harm/kill any animals and stay fit and healthy. rather than slam the vegan why not slam Factory Farming and choose wherever possible to eat only vegetables, pulses, nuts seeds and if you MUST eat meat because you apparenty “have” to then buy only free-range animals, eggs and dairy products. Good luck with that because Agri business dominates and churns out billions of cheap “meat”. That chook you have for dinner – if she was free and living a normal chooky life, she’d have chicks and protect them from hawks. That cow – who became your hamburger mince was a MILKER all her life churning out calf after calf, never allowed to live an love them – as they were pulled from her and killed for veal, that cow. http://www.ciwf.org.uk
Will a vegan diet detoxify your body and make you feel more energetic, YES….will it keep you healthy after the… http://t.co/cGEXuaju
“…Anyone would initially feel better eating raw vegan if he/she had been eating the Standard American Diet previously. Over time, as the body becomes depleted of minerals, serious health issues start to emerge if raw veganism is continued.”
Wow.
For someone who has never personally tried the raw vegan diet, you sure do make some razor sharp observations about it.
I came to these same conclusions myself, but this was only after 3 years of trying like mad to live as a 100% low fat raw vegan. I, too, initially enjoyed wonderful health improvements on this diet, but as time wore on, things been to take to turn for the worse, much to my chagrin, and I ended up being diagnosed with a pretty low B12 deficiency.
Had I continued to listen to the raw vegan gurus whose dogma I knew so well, and ignored my body’s signals of distress during this time, I would no doubt be in very bad shape today.
There IS a tiny, tiny % of people who do well on 100% raw veganism for longer than a year or two, but hardly anyone is around whose been eating this way long term (five years or more). This, to me, speaks to your assertion that this diet is wonderful for CLEANSING but not for nourishing and building long term health.
If a diet is simply too difficult, and too rife with potential health landmines, to be maintained longer than a couple of years at the most, then it’s probably not “man’s ideal diet” (a common claim of raw vegan diets). Extreme diets in general, where one must cut out or severely limit whole food groups, are usually unworkable for all but a tiny minority.
I see that others who have done well on vegan diets are commenting here, sharing their perspective. I do believe that some folks do well on vegan diets, absolutely (and I personally know some some healthy vegans). However, I think these folks are a small % of the population, and that most of us are simply unable to derive all of the nutrients our bodies need from plant foods.
I never would have said this five years ago, but my body’s absolute refusal to cooperate with a long term vegan diet (raw or cooked), taught me otherwise, and I have since connected with many others who were also unable to thrive on that diet.
I now encourage people to find what diet works for them (because there is no “one true diet” that fits all), and to ALWAYS put their body’s feedback before any belief system, no matter how beloved and no matter how many years you’ve invested in it.
I share my own story of diet evolution in detail on my website here:
http://www.my-healthy-eating-secrets.com/healthy-eating.html
Thanks for this excellent article! And thank you, Maria, for sharing your experience – it’s so important to not be scared off by the zealots from sharing the truth of your experiences with raw food or cooked vegan diets. This type of sharing allows the rest of us to learn from each other and to grow. Censoring and attacking those who share their truth doesn’t help anyone – in fact, doing so only exposes your own insecurities and doubt.
Heather\’s last post: Oct 6, My Green Smoothie Secret!
I agree with you Sarah.
I didn’t know that Maria had switched from being a raw vegan – I always find it interesting how long they last, and why they turn to a nutrient dense diet. One question that always crosses my mind is why do raw vegans tend to look gaunt after a year or so on the diet? My opinion is it’s a mode of starvation – what do you think?
As a side note I just have to say that I love the picture. It made me laugh out loud.
Hannah\’s last post: First Giveaway! Lavender Oil
Hannah asks: “One question that always crosses my mind is why do raw vegans tend to look gaunt after a year or so on the diet?”
Interestingly, the low fat version of raw veganism often leads to weight GAIN, especially for women. I know because I was one of them. I gained about 30 pounds on a long term cooked vegan diet, lost most of it when I went raw, then gained it all back by the second year of raw. I have since learned that this is quite common with women attempting the 80 10 10/low fat version of the diet.
A common stereotype of raw vegans is that they all look like Skeletor, but it’s only a stereotype, because weight gain is also quite common.
Heather\’s last post: Oct 6, My Green Smoothie Secret!
This article is completely wrong. You can get all the important nutrients from plants. Animals have Vitamin A and other nutrients from PLANTS people! Think about it!
Vitamin A: It’s true that the preformed active type of this vitamin is found only in animal foods. But plants are abundant in vitamin A precursors like beta-carotene. In fact, these provitamin A compounds are important enough that the USDA measures vitamin A content of foods as “retinol activity equivalents (RAE),” which includes both preformed vitamin A and the compounds that the body turns into vitamin A. There is no separate RDA or recommendation for animal-derived pre-formed vitamin A.
Vitamin D: This vitamin occurs naturally in only a few foods—fatty fish, eggs from chickens who were fed vitamin D, and mushrooms treated with ultraviolet light. With such limited dietary availability, humans wouldn’t have gotten very far if not for the fact that we can make all the vitamin D we need when skin is exposed to sunlight. As humans have moved farther from equatorial zones—and spend less time outdoors—it’s become harder to make enough, though, so vitamin D-fortified foods have become important.
Finally, debunking that K2 argument. Don’t just believe everything you read. Find out the real facts!
Vitamin K: Best sources of this nutrient are leafy green vegetables and canola, soy and olive oils. One form of vitamin K, called vitamin K2 or menaquinone, is found in animal products but in only one lone plant food—natto, a fermented soy product that isn’t a usual part of most western vegan diets. This isn’t a problem, though, because humans have no requirement for vitamin K2. We also have bacteria in our gut that produce this form of vitamin K—so we’re covered either way. Since vitamin K is essential for blood clotting we’d see some evidence of a deficiency if vegans weren’t getting enough. But a study that compared clotting rates between vegans and meat eaters found no difference. (5)
There is no true vitamin A in plants. You are incredibly misinformed. Beta carotene is not vitamin A!
May the gods have mercy on your soul if you’re actually consuming canola and soybean oil.
health care http://bwise.org/site.xml lose weight, G:MbaxIH
ALso ex Vegan. ALMOSt DESTORYED ME! SAVE YOUR SELF.DONT BE STUPID. GOD SAID EAT MEAT!!!! EXCERCISE AND DONT EAT PROCESSED FOODS AND YOU WILL BE GREAT. 8 MONTHS STILL RECOVERING FROM 4 MONTHS VEGAN. IT SUX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Why are vegans encouraged to take vitamin B12 supplements then? If your vegan diet is so natural and complete, you should be able to subsist entirely on vegan foods for health.
{ 3 trackbacks }