Response to Dr. Daniel’s Report on Fermented Cod Liver Oil

by Sarah healthy fatsComments: 217

cod liver oil off the spoon

After initial review of Kaayla Daniel PhD’s report on Green Pasture Products, I felt it necessary to state my current position as a consumer and as a Board member of the Weston A. Price Foundation.

I know it is important to many of you that I weigh in on this issue since it is potentially so upsetting to those who have been using Green Pasture Products and giving them to your children like I have for years.

In this report, Dr. Daniel contends that the Green Pasture’s fermented cod liver oil and butter oil products are rancid and harmful to health. Furthermore, she claims that lab tests show that the fermented cod liver oil isn’t even from cod and is low in the fat soluble vitamins A, D, and K2.

These are serious accusations indeed and ones that cause alarm coming from a professional as highly qualified as Dr. Daniel.

To give you some background, my relationship with Dr. Daniel began in 2007 when I met her at the annual Wise Traditions conference.  I found her to be intelligent and good-humored … with a blog named The Naughty Nutritionist how could you be too serious, right? Over the years she has been a great supporter of the Weston A. Price Foundation’s work, serving on the Board most recently as its Vice President.  She has written many articles for the Weston A. Price website and Wise Traditions Journal. Some of her articles appear here on The Healthy Home Economist website.

So, for Dr. Daniel to deliver a lengthy report that calls into question the integrity of one of the most highly regarded producers of nutrient dense food supplements is a matter to be taken seriously. And I have. And, I can assure you, so has the Foundation.

First of all, let’s look at what we know by way of general background:

  • Cod liver oil and butter oil were both used by Dr. Weston A. Price DDS in his research early in the last century and considered nutrient dense foods high in the fat soluble activators.
  • Green Pastures has been producing and selling cod liver oil and butter oil since at least since 2003 when I was first introduced to the company. The fermented cod liver oil debuted in 2007, and I immediately switched my family to this product which we have been using ever since with stellar results. I know many of you have experienced the same because you have written me about it.
  • Green Pasture Product’s fermented cod liver oil has been tested by two independent labs – one in the USA and in the UK – and found to be free of rancidity while containing valuable nutrients. These tests served as the basis for the WAPF Board deciding in 2014 that claims of rancidity were unfounded.
  • Many leaders in the Real Food community, including Foundation President Sally Fallon Morell, have studied these products in detail and toured the facilities (yes, I’m one of those bloggers Dr. Daniel says were given VIP tours – but what Dr. Daniel fails to mention is that I wasn’t even blogging yet at the time of my tour) and have been convinced of their authenticity and quality – to the point we have been using them ourselves and giving them to our children for nearly 9 years with excellent results – always in the proper dosage and never to excess.
  • Two different laboratories have found mostly vitamin D2 in Green Pasture Products cod liver oil, and Dave was honest enough to share this surprising information with the public. Also, the extra virgin cod liver oil (Rosita) was found to contain mostly D2 by one of these labs as well.  This is something that intrigues the Weston A. Price Foundation Board very much and there are plans in motion already to look into this further.

Secondly, let’s look at what Dr. Daniel claims in her report:

  • The report makes damaging claims that the Green Pasture Products are rancid and therefore harmful and these tests were conducted by several unnamed labs using supposedly superior testing methodology and equipment.
  • The fermented cod liver oil contains average to low amounts of fat soluble vitamins A, D, and K2.
  • DNA testing shows that the fermented cod liver oil doesn’t come from cod, but from the Alaskan Pollock (considered a member of the cod family).
  • The fermented cod liver oil tests for transfats and the most likely way this could happen is via dilution with a rancid vegetable oil of some kind.
  • The High Vitamin Butter oil may come from Argentina and also tests rancid.
  • Vitamin K2 is not what Dr. Price referred to as “Activator X”.

Lastly, here are the initial concerns I have about this report:

  • The labs used to run these tests are unnamed with the letterhead blacked out on the actual lab reports. This is highly unorthodox and is a major red flag. There should be complete transparency here. If the lab work is credible and authentic, the lab should be more than willing to put its name behind the data like is done for other scientific research. Dr. Daniel questioned the reputation and methods of the labs that were fully transparent and reported the fermented cod liver oil to be free of rancidity and high in the fat soluble vitamins, so shouldn’t the labs which claimed they were rancid be closely examined as well? How do we know the tests weren’t run by a rival manufacturer actively seeking to do damage to Mr. Wetzel?
  • Dr. Daniel cites Dr. Ron Schmid ND as one of the funding sources for the report who claims fermented cod liver oil caused him to contract heart disease (which in itself is a questionable claim since he is a sample size of one which is meaningless in scientific terms). In addition, by his own omission, he took excessive amounts of regular cod liver oil for many years (from 1979-2006) and then switched to fermented cod liver oil for another six years, again taking it in megadoses (1-3 Tablespoons per day … up to 9X the recommended daily dosage). This dosage equates to up to 20 teaspoons of salt or 75 glasses of water per day. Such extreme behavior that few if any medical doctors would recommend is not the fault of a product, but rather the fault and poor judgment of the individual taking it. It also indicates a potential lack of objectivity in the report that is concerning.
  • The remainder of the report’s funding is not fully disclosed which raises another serious red flag. Were these other funding sources third parties who stand to financially gain from damaging results?
  • According to a very reliable source, Dr. Daniel notified Dave Wetzel of her concerns regarding the fermented cod liver oil being rancid a year ago, and he responded with an invitation to fly her out to his facility immediately at his expense and spend as much time as she’d like to thoroughly investigate his methods. He took her concerns very seriously and had a number of tests done right away that he forwarded to her. Why Dr. Daniel didn’t respond to his efforts to address her concerns remains unanswered.

Being the professional I know her to be, Dr. Daniel would certainly understand my concerns and would welcome healthy, rigorous scrutiny of the lab work and methods used for testing. I look forward to more clarification on these issues in the coming weeks and months as well as as a point by point rebuttal by Mr. Wetzel. There are always two sides to every story.

In the meantime, given the excellent results I have observed in my own family consuming fermented cod liver oil and high vitamin butter oil for the past 9 years, I see no concrete reason to make any changes until the claims in this report have been thoroughly substantiated with complete and utter transparency. I do very much agree with Dr. Daniel that more study is warranted.

The jury is still out on this and I, for one, am not going to knee jerk and abruptly change what has been working extremely well for my family for many years along with many other families I know.

I hope this summary of my thoughts helps in some way as you decide what is best for your own family.

UPDATES:

The Weston A. Price Foundation has now published a lengthy response to Dr. Daniel’s report.  Click here to review it.

Also, Dr. Chris Masterjohn has published an excellent rebuttal to Dr. Daniel’s report. Click here to review it. I, for one, have now decided to stick with the fermented cod liver oil as I have for the past 9 years based on this thorough analysis!

Trans fats in FCLO? Not so fast!  Here are the latest test results.

Sarah, The Healthy Home Economist

 

More Information

Doctor’s Orders: Why Your Family Needs Fermented Cod Liver Oil

Fermented Cod Liver Oil: Myths and Truths of an Ancient Superfood

Fermented Cod Liver Oil 101 (plus Video How-to)

The Best Way to Swallow Cod Liver Oil

Comments (217)

  • Heather

    The FCLO may indeed be a great product and I have used it a few times before but I have a few problems with it. (I can’t believe no one has mentioned some these problems before.)

    1. One company has the monopoly on this product. I cannot find any other company that sells/makes it. Why is this? This is never a good thing because then the price can be severely inflated. The FCLO is VERY expensive and seems to have a cult following. I have also only seen one other butter oil product. (Ghee is the same but much less expensive, though some will disagree.) I don’t like to be told I can only buy something from one company. That is not okay.
    2. Cod fish is on the endangered species list. (Maybe this is why Pollock is used, albeit fraudulently, if that is true.) I always wondered about this. If it’s endangered, where is all this CLO coming from?
    3. I bought some butter oil from GP (from another seller) and noticed the date on the butter oil was close to expiring. The company I bought it from said that GP had sent that shipment to them recently. I called GP to ask about their expiry dates and they said they were good for a few years but had to put the expiry date on the product due to restrictions. I told the lady I was speaking to that the company I bought it from said they were sent shipments with these dates close to expiring. She became very upset and demanded to know who the company was. She would not let up and kept badgering me for the info. It was a very unpleasant experience. She kept saying that the company I bought it from did not understand their product, and so on. In the end, I had to hang up on her because she was just so disagreeable and would not listen to reason. She even called me back (using call display), not to argue, but under the assumption I was looking for help (from her phone queue.

    November 8th, 2015 3:24 pm Reply
  • Eva

    Thank you for your insight and perspective! We’ve been using FCLO for the past two years in our family and really liked the effects. I was just about starting my 6 mo daughter on it, when I read about the controversy, so I’m gonna hold off until there are more facts out. I really hope it all turns out to be false accusations. It’s always an interesting “coincidence” when controversial research surfaces at the same time a new, competitive product enters the market.
    What are your thoughts on the Rosita CLO?

    October 4th, 2015 7:24 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I don’t take Rosita … Norway pulled it off the market due to contamination with PCBs. http://www.nutraingredients.com/Regulation-Policy/Norway-warns-on-polluted-fish-oil-supplements

      October 5th, 2015 9:00 am Reply
      • Beth

        No, that is ratfish oil.
        It says at the bottom of the article that “and the authority emphasized that regular fish oils, like cod liver oil, were safe.”
        Did you not read the entire article?

        October 20th, 2015 12:43 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          Yes, I did. But, if the company is producing one contaminated oil that was pulled from the market for being dangerous, that is a very bad sign for quality control in my opinion. I will pass on that brand!

          October 21st, 2015 5:37 am Reply
          • Steve Tallent

            That you would on the one hand be concerned that people are trying to do damage to Green Pasture products and then on the other hand spread this rumor about Rosita oils without at all seeking to confirm it is kinda suspicious. If you had done any research at all, you would have discovered that the toxin dioxin was found in CRUDE ratfish oil which is what the lab requested. Finished product tests well below EU standards because of filtration.

            October 26th, 2015 7:14 pm
          • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

            Um, Norway pulled Rosita off the shelves and not just the crude ratfish oil either .. the actual bottles that were on sale at retail so Norway obviously had reason to believe that even the filtered product was contaminated too. If you have an issue with the story, take it up with the Norwegian health authorities.

            October 26th, 2015 9:47 pm
  • CeciliaL

    My family and I started consuming GP FCLO 4.5 years ago as we started the GAPS diet. We were advised by Dr Natasha to start very slowly to control detoxification. Vitamin A has very strong detoxification properties and this very well can cause rashes and many nasty symptoms. We followed the advice, passed the very long detox stage, healed our guts and minds and have since come off the GAPS diet.
    In the 4.5 years we have never had to use antibiotics and very rarely got sick. We had a background of frequent antibiotic use due to recurrent respiratory infections, we were told by our doctor we had to have antibiotics as often as 3-4 times a year.
    GP FCLO corrected many hormonal issues we had and made us feel like super humans when colds were around.
    When I read Dr Daniel’s report I stopped having GP FCLO. My daughter got the flu from peers at school. I got the flu as well but after the shock I had from reading the report I could not dare to have GP FCLO. The flu has progressed very badly and it looks like it has developed into a respiratory infection. I have not felt this sick for 4.5years.
    Thank you Sarah and Carrie for your posts. I have re-started taking my beloved GP FCLO today. I hope I recover from this one without the use of antibiotics.
    I really wish Dr Daniel and all who are seeking to have a gain on the Rosita’s product at the expense of others get the punishment they deserve.
    My apologies Dave Wetzel for doubting your product after all the benefits we got from it.

    September 19th, 2015 4:49 am Reply
  • Shaila B.

    For me Green Pasture’s Fermented Cod Liver Oil really helps my anxiety and fibromyalgia. I cannot live without it. You would think my body which is so overly senstive would give me warning signs not to take it. But, it never does it craves it!

    September 14th, 2015 3:40 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I think it is *shameful* that some who don’t tolerate FCLO very well are obviously trying to shut the company down with false “science”, personal agendas, and even attempting to get the government involved for “fraud”. Who do these people think they are to get on their high horse and say that FCLO is inappropriate and “bad” for everyone and try to deny access for those people who desperately need it by bad mouthing and trying to bankrupt a family business with a long history of value in the marketplace. Let the naysayers take something else or nothing if they like. That is their choice! But, leave Green Pasture Products alone! There are *many* people who benefit from it and have been taking it for years (in the appropriate dosages of course). It is clear to me that this whole thing is nothing but a covert marketing operation for a competitor of FCLO that seems to think the best way to build a business is to tear down another one. Don’t fall for it people!

      September 14th, 2015 4:19 pm Reply
      • Monika

        I completely agree. It’s like a middle school slander campaign. As someone who ferments at home, I regularly use my eyes and nose to check on my ferments. I found an older bottle of FCLO in the back of one of my cabinets and it smells and tastes fine. I tried to make this comment on a blog post bashing GP but it was deleted. No surprise.

        November 9th, 2015 11:25 am Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          Yes, the whole thing reeks (pun definitely intended) of the personal, not the scientific. Especially when you factor in those ridiculous, Jerry Springer type video interviews on the subject. It would be laughable if it wasn’t so sad.

          November 9th, 2015 12:33 pm Reply
  • Craig

    her whole report is unscientific. She has done a good job at making it look like a legitimate paper, but she just cannot interpret results in an unbiased manner. I’ve done a good (if I might say so myself) analysis of her findings here: thehealthcloud.co.uk/green-pastures-rancid-report-analysis

    The best is her rather wild and unfounded claims that FCLO is a cheap inport from China – where is the evidence for that?

    September 11th, 2015 10:50 am Reply
  • Victoria

    I will continue to take FCLO. I know from my own experience how excellent it is. Before taking it I had terrible issues with plaque. After starting to use GP, my plaque issues have nearly disappeared altogether. I am firmly behind GO FCLO and WAPF. Daniels can go take a leap.

    September 6th, 2015 4:47 pm Reply
  • Carrie Hahn

    The following letter was to be posted on David Gumpert’s blog, however, Mr. Gumpert has refused to post it and has now also taken the liberty to edit other peoples posts which is completely unprofessional. Please share this information…..~Carrie
    **********

    I spent several hours rereading all three of Mr. Gumpert’s blog posts and accompanying comments. I replied to several, but would like to point out a few things that have not yet been said.

    It is my opinion that this was a carefully orchestrated propaganda blitzkrieg which began rolling out on August 6, 2015 with the PPNF’s article “Cod Liver Oil: A Historical perspective.” About a week later, Dr. Schmid published his story “Too Much of a NOT so Good Thing;
    A True Story from Dr. Ron,” in his newsletter and on his website. On August 15th Corganic posted the PPNF article on their Facebook Page and on the 20th they published “Would EVCLO be considered as “Excellent” by Weston A. Price himself?” on their website. corganic.com/blog/weston-a-price-cod-liver-oil. On August 20th Dr. Daniel publishes her article “Hook Line and Stinker,” Erin Elizabeth from Health Nut News healthnutnews.com/breaking-phd-vice-president-of-weston-price-foundation-writes-damning-report-on-fermented-cod-liver-oil/ …..and Sarah Smith from Nourished and Nurtured nourishedandnurtured.blogspot.com/2015/08/shocking-test-results-for-fermented-cod.html
    All of above have ties to one another and/or Corganic. Of course, David Gumperts blog posts began on August 22nd as well.

    However, the timeline and alliances really start much earlier than that. In 2009 Kaayla Daniel stayed at my house while she was in town to speak at the Farm to Table Conference in Pittsburgh. I was also a client of hers. During her visit she told me that she was very unhappy with Sally Fallon’s decision to publish “The Whole Soy Story,” and she believes that this decision caused her to lose books sales because this made the book more expensive and difficult for most to afford. Likewise, Dr. Schmid has complained to many within WAPF that he was very unhappy with some editing choices Sally made in publishing his book. But the most shocking thing she shared that weekend was her concerned over Bio-Kult, and that it may contain a strain of bacteria (streptococcus thermophilus) that could be deadly. She told me that she thought there may be a connection to Chapter Leader Deidre Welch’s sudden death from a brain aneurysm and it may have been due to the Bio-Kult she was taking. Dr. Daniel told me that another woman in North Carolina also died under similar circumstances and that Kaayla had shared her concerns with Sally Fallon. In recent conversations, Sally (and other board members) confirmed that Kaayla did approach her about Bio-Kult with the premise that it may be related to Deidre’s death, as well as a women in North Carolina which Kaayla never did name. Kaayla even contacted Dr. Natasha Campbell McBride, but with no documentation to back up her claim.

    I knew Deidre, back when she was Deidre Currie. She was amazing and absolutely gorgeous; we were all devastated by her loss. I never heard anything more about issues with Bio-Kult and just assumed that they were not able to find any direct link, but my family and I did, for some time, discontinue using Bio-Kult because of Kaayla’s expressed concerns over this product.

    I think it is important to point out that Diedre’s husband is a co-founder of Corganic. I had never looked at their website until this controversy over Green Pasture Products FCLO erupted and I find interesting that Corganic also sells a probiotic. On their website, they state that their product does not contain “unwanted additives” such as cellulose, soy, milk and specifically that “No strains that are reported to cause reactions (e.g. streptococcus thermophilus, etc).” All of which are contained in Bio-Kult. There are some associations here that I feel are more than coincidental.

    Continuing… on 1/14/03 Sarah Smith of Nourished and Nurtured, who was mentioned earlier and advertises Corganic on her website, published her first blog degrading GPP in favor of Corganic in a post titled “Why We Stopped Taking Fermented Cod Liver Oil.” nourishedandnurtured.blogspot.com/2013/01/why-we-stopped-taking-fermented-cod.html

    Sometime in March 2015 (I don’t recall exactly) Dave Wetzel contacted me about accusations Dr. Daniel had made about his products. He told me that he offered to fly Kaayla up to his facility, all expenses paid, so that she could get a better understanding of his manufacturing process, but that she never responded to his offer. He was devastated by the accusations and began sending samples out immediately for testing. I had not heard anything further about any of this until the blitzkrieg began, culminating in the release of the Dr. Daniel’s “Hook Line and Stinker.” It took me a week to finally finish reading her venomous article which made me physically ill to read.

    So about now you are wondering what my connection is to GPP, so here’s it is.

    I became a WAPF Chapter Leader in 2004. A year later I started a business selling nutrient dense foods, including GPP Blue Ice Cod Liver Oil (before FCLO had been developed), Celtic Sea Salt and Nature’s Blessings Coconut Oil, etc. In 2010, I couldn’t afford to pay for the Wise Traditions Conference so I asked Dave Wetzel if he needed any help at his booth. Dave had always been very helpful to me in explaining his products, but I knew the best place to learn would be standing at the booth so that I could to listen to him answer questions, and ask a few of my own. My daughter Katie, came along and sold raffle tickets all weekend, along with Dave’s daughter, for the Alaska trip that the Wetzels donated to the Farm to Consumer Legal Defense Fund. My daughters and I have done this every year since.

    A couple years later, after a series of difficult moves for my family, I decided to close my business. Shortly after that, and without knowing what I had decided, Dave asked if I could work for him to handle product questions. It is a very, very part time job, and I was only contracted with them for one year. Since then, I am happy to put in a few hours throughout the year so that I might attend one of the best conferences of the year, as one of his helpers at the Green Pasture booth.

    I would also like to point out that I am no longer a WAPF Chapter Leader for the Pittsburgh Area, which I had done for 10 years. Nor am I even a member. I made this decision in the spring of 2014, just a year and a half after receiving the Activist Award at the 2012 Wise Tradition Conference, when my activism began pulling me away from spreading the great information provided by the WAPF, and I began shifting my focus toward protecting my family and my organic farm from the dangers of natural gas extraction, or fracking. We may have differences of opinion on certain topics, and it can take time to work through disagreements, but I will not throw the baby out with the bath water and I fully support their position on this cod liver oil debate.

    It is no secret that the PPNF has been at odds with the WAPF. Anyone who has been involved with this organization as long as I have is no doubt aware of their strained relationship. In my opinion, the timing of the release of the PPNF article, followed shortly after with Facebook posts by Corganic, is highly suspect. This is a direct attack against GPP, although not quite as blatant as the language used in a publication Corganic intended to distribute at the 2012 WT conference in Santa Clara, CA. Sally insisted that they remove the publication as they would not tolerate any company bashing another to increase their own bottom line. Copies are still available if you would like to see one.

    It’s really not hard to connect the dots. A few internet searches will verify everything I have said. I am so deeply disappointed by the actions of the people involved in all of this and I am devastated for the Wetzel Family. They are the nicest and most generous people I know. Dave worked very hard on his products and believed in what he had learned from the WAPF; that there were traditional methods to so many food preparations and he discovered that cod liver oil was no exception. He has released as much as he can, as far as manufacturing and testing, but he has a recipe to protect! For crying out loud!!! The accusations that he has not been forthcoming are so unfair. People in this community have been quick to judge and point fingers, yet no one has taken into consideration that he has a lot of time and money invested in his product, and he has the right hold some proprietary secrets.

    I hope this community will take a step back and take a look at the key players in this propaganda campaign. Some of you have been unwitting accomplices promoting lies that all originate from the same source.

    September 4th, 2015 10:43 am Reply
    • Judy

      Those commenters who want to limit the discussion of FCLO to the “scientific facts” given to us by Daniel in her “expose” have been shown by Carrie that politics are inseparable from discussing the merits or demerits of FCLO. The political background Carrie presents shows that the intent of GPs competitors is to put GP our of business. Having one less source from whom to purchase CLO is not a good thing for consumers who want health products that are made the traditional way.

      In the Wise Traditions Winter Q, WAPF will give us a non-hysterical presentation of all the scientific facts we need to know in order to make a decision about whether or not to use FCLO. Science doesn’t yet have answers to the questions we are demanding answers to, but I know enough right now to judge the merits of Daniel’s “expose”, and it receives a big Thumbs Down from me.

      September 4th, 2015 3:18 pm Reply
  • Ken Hanson

    Hi Sarah, I believe I had seen you mention, at some point, that you refuse to eat anything out of Alaska? The wild caught salmon our family purchases is from Alaska and I am curious what the issue there is? Thank you!

    Ken

    September 1st, 2015 7:59 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I don’t eat Alaskan salmon anymore … only Atlantic salmon. However, I recently muscle tested the GPP fermented cod liver oil and it turned out fine for me, so I will continue to use it.

      September 1st, 2015 3:28 pm Reply
      • Ken Hanson

        I thought Atlantic salmon was farm-rasied. Where do you buy your salmon?

        September 2nd, 2015 2:25 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          I get wild salmon from Scotland.

          September 2nd, 2015 4:41 pm Reply
  • Jeanmarie

    Sarah, thanks for an excellent summary of the situation. I appreciate the care you took to be thorough, fair, and keep it about the facts, not the personalities. I’ve been going through all the blog posts and statements and Facebook comments on this issue, and this is one of the best articles I’ve read. For those interested in looking at some of the more technical aspects of testing fats and lipid biochemistry, Chris Kresser wrote up an excellent post recently as well.

    Brava, Sarah! I, too, am waiting to see what’s what. More information is what we need, not rushing to judgment, especially on the wings of a problematic report with its own dubious methodology.

    August 30th, 2015 1:22 pm Reply
  • Bonnie

    I believe full disclosure of charitable donations may give us more answers than the all this squabling. I’d like to know if Green Pasture donates to WAPF? Where the money came from for ALL the lab testing?

    August 29th, 2015 11:15 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      Bonnie, if you click the link to the WAPF response above at the end of the article, this is answered in great detail. As for Dr. Daniel, she has said she won’t disclose all of her funding sources other than Dr. Ron’s.

      August 29th, 2015 12:31 pm Reply
  • Victor Cozzetto

    The Weston A. Price Foundation has posted their response, in a great Q&A with Sally Fallon Morell. It is in full support of Dave Wetzel, Green Pasture, and their FCLO products. Of course it is at the same time invalidating Dr. Daniel’s report. I love the response, and I think it adds a lot of good insights:

    http://www.westonaprice.org/uncategorized/questions-and-answers-about-fermented-cod-liver-oil-fclo/#comment-251019

    There is nothing in that response that I disagree with (not that my opinion matters), except for perhaps her use of the word ‘stinky.’ :-)

    Enjoy your FCLO everyone :-)

    August 29th, 2015 1:15 am Reply
  • janice curtin

    I think we need to remember that not all people digest and absorb fats like Cod Liver oil equally. If they have a high toxin load they may have problems with fat metabolism. I have had that experience and have seen it in others. If you are taking something or eating something to increase your detoxification it can often cause gallbladder /liver stress and you need to back off taking cod liver oil for a while. That was my case and i now take Nature’s Answer, recommended by the Foundation. It is lemon lime flavored and delicious. I have been seeing health improvements, with my higher vitamin A levels, including better hearing and better skin.

    Janice Alexandria WAPF chapter leader

    August 28th, 2015 9:11 am Reply
    • Gina

      I am so glad you commented Janice. You are so right. NOT EVERYONE CAN TAKE FCLO! I have never been able to tolerate FCLO. I was told by friends, who got great results, to get the HVBO so I could get better absorption but even that did not help. I have a history of autoimmune issues, bowel issues, hypothyroidism, chronic fatigue, etc. so I finally invested in a integrative holistic practitioner and found out I have the MTHFR gene mutation, leaky gut, yeast overgrowth, and a whole slew of other issues. What this means is my toxic load is through the roof so as you stated above, I cannot handle the fat metabolism and stress on my gut.

      My mom always tells me how my grandparents took CLO faithfully and they lived well into their 90’s with little health issues. I also remember reading a blog article from a woman who took the GP CLO (and loved it!) and was forced to buy the FCLO when they stopped making CLO and hated it. She ended up buying a different brand of CLO. I plan to purchase the Nature’s Answer brand now thanks to your comment! I really need the Vit A. I can’t seem to get enough due to my absorption issues. Thanks for your insights!

      August 29th, 2015 1:17 am Reply
  • Ann

    Wow! How exciting. Naughty naughty Dr. Daniels, who paid for your 5 tests if each test is $10,000. If I remember correctly in the “Oiling Of America” Sally said, “follow the money”, and I wonder where that trail will lead? Rosita? Dr. Ron, who so happens to run 10 miles a day, very stressful to the heart, poor man seems to go overboard on every thing.

    I took my FCLO and HVBO this morning and will continue to do so with the same confidence I had when I started 9 years ago after I did my own due diligence. I called David on Monday and he answered all of my questions with out hesitation. I suggested he put out a video of the Argentina farm, a family farm for 120 years.

    Time is your real money and Dr. Daniels has really put out a stinky time waster.

    I look forward to how David will respond to this challenge, what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger.

    August 27th, 2015 4:05 pm Reply
    • Bill Williams

      But the WAPF paid too have testing too. As did Green Pastures. Why is it eeeevil for Dr. Daniel to pay for testing, but not the others, Ann?

      August 28th, 2015 4:25 pm Reply
      • Judy

        Because Dr. D did not reveal WHO paid for the tests. WAPF is transparent. Dr. D is keeping secrets. It matters WHO is paying for the attack on Green Pasture. And it matters WHY Dr. D is keeping her funding a secret. Doesn’t it? Something is rotten, and it’s not FLCO.

        August 29th, 2015 11:43 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          The unprofessional tone of the report and the manner in which it was released reveals much about the true intent IMO.

          August 30th, 2015 12:20 am Reply
        • Bill Williams

          This line of argument is damaging to WAPF, Judy. Outsiders see defensiveness based in clear bias. How is revealing or not revealing sources going to affect the scientific arguments? Generally speaking it wont. For example, no technical criticism that Daniels made would magically switch from “true” to “false” (or vice versa) were the funding sources revealed. I’m surprised that you guys are embarrassed to be focusing on these kinds of ad hominem methods… one thing Dr. Daniels largely avoided, despite many pot shots about here “tone” — a red flag in these sorts of arguments. if the sources are revealed it will just make WAPF look worse.

          The answer is to get to the bottom of the scientific concerns raised. Chris Kressers article takes this approach.

          chriskresser.com/separating-fact-from-fiction-on-cod-liver-oil/

          While I found some comfort in some of the points where he argued against, or at least moderated, Dr. Daniels points. But I think it’s worth pointing out that he also underscored some of here concerns, and switched to non-fermented oil some time ago.

          Chris Masterjohn’s recent article also focuses on the science, to his credit. Unfortunately Masterjohn also has a conflict of interest. This is not a moral failing, it’s just a fact. The article is still worth reading, and I believe he has approached it in an intellectually honest way.

          I found even more comfort in reading this article, but I think it’s hardly the final word and it does not allow me (or Chris, I think) to dismiss all of the concerns Daniels raised.

          Further, now know that WAPF has the sort of financial relationship that is unacceptable for an organization that is funding research. It’s known that these kinds of relationships bias organizations. It’s clear that WAPF has such a relationship — regardless of where the science ends up, their ability to maintain objectivity is compromised. By contrast we do not know that Dr. Daniel has such as relationship (although I admit, it seems likely, many Doctors could afford such tests on their personal salary).

          Ad hominem attacks, questioning motives and tone is damaging to all participants. I read through this thread and read a lot of logical fallicies and defensiveness, not stopping with ad hominem and criticism of tone/”professionalness” etc. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

          This is natural for humans, and I think, especially in a community that contains many people who could be described as fundamentalists, in a certain sense (I do not mean this as a criticism). But by rising above it I think everyone will benefit more.

          I don’t believe it’s wrong for financially motivated people on either side of the debate to introduce criticism, nor to do tests. Using multiple third party labs goes a long way towards addressing their bias, and Kresser appears to be correct that many such lab contracts prevent revealing the source. Focusing on these aspects sullies the people who do it.

          Sarah, I want to state that I appreciate your long-term and current efforts on this blog. It is honorable and admirable to let people on all sides make all kinds of criticisms. Thanks!

          August 30th, 2015 10:39 am Reply
          • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

            Let me clarify that Chris Masterjohn has no conflict of interest. As an Honorary Board member of the WAPF, he gets no pay and both Rosita AND GPP are exhibitors at the WAPF Conferences. Chris Kresser would have one though as he sells GPP on his website and also other brands which he recommends. Although, to be fair, the amount of money he makes from that is likely trivial and likely does not in any way affect his views.

            Also, if you read the WAPF rebuttal statement to Dr. Daniel’s “report”, you will see detailed how GPP affects the bottom of line of the WAPF balance sheet .. essentially little to no effect. The WAPF doesn’t need GPP and in fact recommended the product long before GPP ever became a vendor at Conferences.

            August 30th, 2015 11:38 am
          • Judy

            I too want the truth about the benefits of CLO and FCLO and therefore welcome this debate. Those of us who are using the GP product want confirmation that we are using the best product on the market. Most of us, including me, are not scientists specializing in lipids, nor are we marine biologists, and so we base our opinion on how the product works for us, and what objective experts – this excludes Daniel – say about it. .

            That said, in looking at the reports from WAPF, Wetzel, Masterjohn, and Daniel, I’m paying no attention to the “facts” Daniel presents because of the manner in which she presented her report and the sensationalist tone. Both of these reasons tarnish her message. I have NO confidence in what she has written. I DO have confidence in what WAPF and Masterjohn and others, whom I consider to be rational “truth seekers”, have to say. WAPF will be presenting a thorough report on this issue in the Wise Traditions Winter Quarterly, which I am patiently awaiting. Again, I want the truth, but Daniel’s “truth” is too riddled with “conflicts of interest” to take her word as anything other than muck racking journalism..

            September 1st, 2015 4:05 pm
          • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

            I would suggest getting muscle tested Judy. This is what I did to confirm what I already suspected … the fermented cod liver oil is the best choice for me. The other virgin cod liver oils tested much worse.

            September 1st, 2015 6:09 pm
      • Josh

        Bill, Sally Fallon reveals that the income received from Green Pastures (for when Green Pastures sponsors at a WAPF conference) totals about 1.1% of their annual budget. It’s hard to believe that “following the money” in this case would result in anything subversive. WAPF has been very forward about this (transparent) but Dr. Daniels is not. Read more about it here: http://www.westonaprice.org/uncategorized/questions-and-answers-about-fermented-cod-liver-oil-fclo/

        August 30th, 2015 4:05 pm Reply
  • D.

    This reminds me of the big flap a few years back between WAPF and Dr. Mercola re: CLO and its vitamin A. As far as I’m concerned, there was never a satisfactory answer regarding that issue either.

    I tend to want to agree with Dr. Daniel. She has put a lot on the line to question this product and IMPHHO she must have had her reasons/suspicions for doing so.

    Let’s wait until it all comes out in the wash in about 4 years because that’s how long this will take, if we ever do get real answers. Dave Wetzel is talking lawyers where he should be more concerned about the science, since everyone seems to put so much stock in science. Personally, I don’t trust science because it’s for sale. Everything is for sale, at a price, so when Wetzel talks lawyers right off the bat, it makes me highly suspicious.

    But, you know, that’s just me.

    If you want to know why I question science and scientists, just take a gander at the book written recently by Dr. Malcolm Kendrick (a Scottish cardiologist) called Doctoring Data. What an eye-opener. You’ll never look at science or health or doctors the same way ever again, I assure you. Superb reading.

    August 27th, 2015 1:37 pm Reply
    • Josh

      D. – Where is Dave Wetzel talking lawyers? I haven’t seen this yet. I hope it is not true. I hope he and Daniels hire a mutually agreed upon mediator and work the issues out without lawyers.

      If Wetzel gets as slanderous with Daniels as she has with him, I may just boycott his products on principal. There is nothing like his FCLO on the market, but if he goes that route, it will not make me feel good about using the product anymore.

      Mr. Wetzel, if you’re reading this, I pray you do this with dignity…for all.

      September 3rd, 2015 12:52 am Reply
      • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

        Dave will never sink to Dr. Daniel’s level. I’ve never seen him behave in anything but a professional manner.

        September 3rd, 2015 8:50 am Reply
  • Joy

    I have learned a lot from Sarah and I will always be grateful for that, but I truly am concerned that there is and will be damage done to people who use this fermented cod oil,. I am certainly not going to take it again. It is standard operating procedure not to give out the name of the labs who did the testing, unless they are paid much more money than Dr.Daniels and the others who paid for the testing could afford Go to Dr Daniel’s web site
    and read her rebuttal of Sarah’s article about all this. And I agree with Isabel Natrin and others who said that Dr Daniels could not have taken this step lightly, and with out knowing what it impact it would make. I, personally cannot follow any money trail here. Wait till you read what Dr Daniels says about Sally Fallon’s idea of the proper dosage of FCLO for people like herself and others who are so hard working and under stress. Ok, I have my doubts about this being printed but I had to try, I am worried about people continuing to use the stuff, till there really is an independent test done by Weston Price.

    August 27th, 2015 9:29 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      Hi Joy, the WAPF has already independently tested the FCLO for rancidity and this occurred last year. It was done by a highly reputable lab in the UK and was the basis for the WAPF Board voting 7-1 against futher testing and that Dr. Daniel’s concerns about the product were unfounded. http://www.westonaprice.org/uncategorized/concerns-about-fermented-cod-liver-oil/

      August 27th, 2015 10:05 am Reply
      • S.

        Testing will be inaccurate because it’s gone to a progressive stage of rancidity that tests low for the given markers of rancidity. I operate two labs one in Madison, WI and one in France. I’ll be conducting seperate tests in my field.

        August 27th, 2015 10:25 am Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          The WAPF is coming out with a statement shortly that clarifies rancidity testing and the different worldviews on the subject within the scientific community.

          August 27th, 2015 10:30 am Reply
  • Erin Elizabeth -HealthNutNews

    My other half of 6 years (Dr Mercola) and I sure won’t EVER be taking it and with all the people who write me asking if they should take it? I wouldn’t give CFLO to my worst enemy in 1000 years. If I have to write back every last person who wrote me asking about it I will.

    Oh and I don’t do any fish oils so it’s not like I’m recommending some alternative either.

    August 27th, 2015 3:03 am Reply
    • Erin Elizabeth -HealthNutNews

      PS several people who used to work for Weston A Price posted on my FB too that they’d never take the stuff again and showed actual pictures of rashes they got from taking CFLO (I don’t know what brand) All those things I’ve stated are facts.

      August 27th, 2015 3:05 am Reply
      • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

        The WAPF has *never* claimed that the fermented cod liver oil was appropriate for every individual. This is why a number of brands are recommended on the WAPF CLO page: http://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/cod-liver-oil-basics-and-recommendations/#brands

        August 27th, 2015 7:07 am Reply
        • Cheerios

          She’s a vegan apologist. Dr Mercola while not vegan took FCLO and laid out in the sun on vacation, ate pastured meats, etc and claimed his vitamin D levels went too high. Remarkably he was able to offer better choices by selling krill oil and selling tanning beds. Lol.
          Both he and his girlfriend seem like lovely people with many good things to say, but they are just people that aren’t 100% correct at the end of the day.

          August 27th, 2015 9:10 am Reply
        • Pat B.

          Yes, I read WAPF’s response to the public but it is a very different response that was sent out to Chapter Leaders—Sally Fallon Morell sent an email forbidding you to publicly discuss any of the issues I and others have raised about FCLO under threat of being removed as a chapter leader. No “negative comments about products we recommend” allowed or there will be legal action. It sounds more like a dictatorship. It is very sad to see as I thought WAPF really cared about the health of people. It is very evident that it does not when a dictator threatens lawsuits if you say anything negative. This is a free country. Why don’t you stand up for what is right??

          September 21st, 2015 8:28 pm Reply
          • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

            Pat, you are misinformed and believing gossip and spin posted on sensationalist blogs. The message sent to the Chapter Leaders made no mention of legal action or a “no discussion” policy. The message simply stated that slanderous criticism of competing brands is not allowed and that it is the same for exhibitors at the Conferences who cannot denigrate competitors .. only talk about the good things in their products. It is of course fine to say “I find this brand works best for me,” or “My children like this brand the best.”

            By the way, this policy is not new. It has been in place ever since I became a Chapter Leader in 2002. It is also exactly the same as it is for raw milk producers … raw milk farmers are *not allowed to criticize* competitors or they are removed from realmilk.com Also, Chapter Leaders are *not allowed* to criticize, denigrate, or gossip about other Chapter Leaders or they are removed as Chapter Leaders. *** This has been the policy for well over a decade **** The WAPF tries to stay positive understanding that others have differing opinions which are free to be shared and discussed, but not in a critical, negative, slanderous manner.

            September 21st, 2015 8:44 pm
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I’m grateful I’ve used it for 9 years (and regular cod liver oil because that was all that was available before that for another 5 years) and will continue to do so. 3 children, no antibiotics for going on 17 years, all straight teeth and no autoimmune issues or other chronic problems. Pretty good track record I would say that is pretty rare these days. Of course, we *always* take it in the appropriate dosage.

      August 27th, 2015 7:09 am Reply
      • Jenn

        Sarah, I feel the same about my family. Very healthy family. I have 4 small children and none have ever been to the hospital or doctor for anything besides routines checkups. Never had any antibiotics, etc. However, we could also argue that we do other things that could be contributing to that health. If we were eating the same way as the rest of society and the only difference was “FCLO”, then that would be a pretty convincing argument. I’m sure that at least part of the reason we enjoy that health is because we try to be very cautious and aware about what we put in our bodies. Is it possible that that the health we experience has noting to do with the “FCLO”, but is simply a results of all the other choices we make? Is it possible that “FCLO” actually has been damaging our health, but all our other good choices has still protected us from the negative effects of the “FCLO” ? Just some things I’ve been wondering :(

        August 27th, 2015 9:22 am Reply
  • Cora

    I have only used one bottle of Green Pastures’ FCLO, and it was the butter oil blend with cinnamon flavouring. My experience was that it helped immensely to energize and heal me, and I detected no rancidity. The very first dose gave me misgivings because it caused me to belch all day. (I very rarely belch, otherwise.) The aftertaste was cinnamon, not fish. My friend advised me to have the dose with food. I did not always take her advice, but never experienced adverse effects thereafter, anyway. The fish flavour was detectable, especially to the nose, but never offensive. Overall, I found this supplement pleasant to use, and I never believed I was using an inferior product. I would absolutely buy more if I could afford it.

    August 26th, 2015 6:44 pm Reply
  • Steve

    Thanks for your response. It seems pretty reasonable. I too wish that Dr. Daniel would disclose the labs and scientists – although there are a few names in the body of the report. The funding sources should be of no concern unless labs and scientists are in the habit of taking requests and churning out results to suit clients. If the lab results from this report are suspect due to funding source, then any lab report paid for by WAPF would also need to be suspect, as there are a lot of sponsor and advertising dollars at stake, and any lab test paid for by Green Pasture would be doubly suspect as besides the money at stake, there is also the issue that they control the sample whereas anybody else has to pull a bottle off the shelf.

    I’m super concerned about the transfats detected, the possibility of vegetable oil, and the DNA test showing pollock. Transfats are so bad that even the FDA has finally taken action against them and given manufacturers until 2018 to get them out of foods. We don’t use vegetable oil even in cooking – we sure don’t want it in our health food product, much less a one supposed to be of the highest quality for which we are paying premium dollars. Yes, pollock might be cod, but requests to the FDA to be able label product as cod are still “under review” and cod is not an acceptable marketname for pollock. Ethical issues aside, labeling pollock as cod would therefore be illegal.

    I would like to see more transparency from Green Pastures as far as sourcing, methodology, and the like. We demand that in everything. We want to know everything in the world about where our dairy and meat and veggies come from. Is it a heritage breed or not? What are are eating and/or fed, how and where are kept. Is it ethical? Is it sustainable? Organic? Wild? GMO? We want to know if it is ethical. Some people even want to know if the animals are happy. It can get ridiculous and a skit in Portlandia of a waiter reading off chicken bios for a couple to select for dinner highlighted that. But this is a hallmark of the real food movement. We read labels. If I advertise eucalyptus globulus from China, but deilverRoman and deliver eucalyptus globulus from Australia, it doesn’t matter that they are both eucalyptus oil and even the same exact species and that the oil that I provided was the pricier of the two. I have an ethical responsibility to deliver exactly what I offered. If I can’t then I need to let my customers know that, and offer them a refund. GP has been vary vague about sourcing. We source some herbs from China. Some people don’t like that. But we tell them anyway. We just have to explain that China has vast regions where modern farming techniques, seeds, pesticides and fertilizers hasn’t arrived yet. Many still aren’t happy, but most do understand. I can’t think of any proprietary or intellectual property type reason for not disclosing sourcing unless there are things you really don’t want your customers to know – as in, the customers wouldn’t like it.

    August 26th, 2015 5:34 pm Reply
  • KTB

    Interested to see how this turns out. We took the very expensive FCLO for 2 full years while on GAPS and then all of a sudden all 3 of us taking it couldn’t tolerate it anymore, meaning symptoms of food cross contamination that had disappeared started returning. If it was just one of us in the family, I could see blaming it on a food intolerance cropping up. But the fact that all 3 of us were having an adverse reaction told me all I needed to know. I’ve become a cynic, though, for ANY supplements because I have found they all seem to have loopholes for safety or cross contamination issues.

    August 26th, 2015 1:02 pm Reply
  • Christina

    I have mixed feelings about all of this information. I’ve got serious concerns about Dr. Daniel’s allegations but also serious concerns about her report and how there is no transparency whatsoever. Having said that, I have a question I’m hoping this community can help me answer.

    I’ve been taking GP FCLO for 3 years now, including one pregnancy. My almost five-year-old has been taking it that long and my 18 month old has been taking it for a year. In all that time, I have never experienced a bottle of FCLO that I perceived to be rancid. Am I understanding this correctly that if it was truly rancid, I would know by the smell and consistency, etc? Because all I’ve ever smelled is fish! Now, I don’t particularly like that smell because I don’t like fish, but I assume that is not what others who are claiming rancidity are referring to. As far as a burning feeling in my throat, I have definitely experienced that a time or two but I also take the cinnamon flavor and assumed that was the reason.

    I am asking all of this because I’m not convinced yet that I should stop taking it. My family is rarely sick (my 4 1/2 year old has never, NOT ONCE, been to the doctor for an illness!). My children have never had a single ear infection, a case of diarrhea or the flu. I also feed them very well, but I have to believe FCLO plays a role. So for me, like another poster mentioned, the proof is in the pudding. But I’d like to make sure I’m assessing this rancidity claim the right way.

    Thanks in advance for any comments.

    August 26th, 2015 12:25 pm Reply
    • Jenn

      Hi Susanna,

      I’m not sure about the answer to your question. I always just taste the fish, as well. I’m guessing that if we could all taste/smell the rancidity…it would have been more obvious to more folks without lab results needed.

      Personally, I’m more concerned about the possible mislabeling. If pollock is used, trans fats are added, and essential oils are used, this should be labeled. Green Pastures and WAPF encourage this product for pregnant women, nursing mothers, small children and we all should know exactly what is in that very expensive bottle.

      August 26th, 2015 1:17 pm Reply
      • Jenn

        Sorry, I was actually responding to Christina’s post and typed the wrong name.

        August 26th, 2015 1:32 pm Reply
    • Ellen

      Hi Christina,

      I just wanted to share a little input. I’ve gotten both the FCLO and the Fskate liver oil (for variety) from Green Pastures.

      I kept forgetting to take it and I ended up with half a bottle a year later. The skate liver oil was still perfect, same smell, same taste (I like fish so I think it’s great). But the FCLO had a prominent odor that told me it was rancid. It was a big change. Not so much a fishy smell but just a typical bad oil smell.

      I think the FCLO went bad but the skate liver oil didn’t because I accidentally wiped up drip with my finger on the lip of the FCLO and I contaminated the bottle. I noticed the smell shortly after that.
      Definitely chalking that up to user error. :)

      So that’s just an FYI, if its bad… it will smell much different. Kind of like bad nuts.

      September 7th, 2015 3:34 pm Reply
  • Susanna

    Hi Sarah, Can you please tell me by what measure/cross-walk you arrived at this statement from your post?

    “This dosage equates to up to 20 teaspoons of salt or 75 glasses of water per day.”

    What scientific fact do you base this equation? That 20 tsp of salt = 75 glasses of water = 1-3 Tablespoons FCLO ?

    For the record, we used to take GP FCLO but simply couldn’t afford it as our family grew. I’m following this closely, and truly hope reasonable, professional behavior abounds from all sides.

    August 26th, 2015 11:18 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      The average person is recommended to drink 8 glasses of water per day. 72 glasses represents 9 times that amount. The suggested dosage of FCLO is 1 tsp per day …. 3 TBL would be nine times that amount (1 tsp = 1 TBL). Hope that helps.

      August 26th, 2015 11:46 am Reply
  • Michael

    Why the governments of the whole world can be wrong about cholesterol and fat, but a much smaller organization like the WAPF cannot be wrong about FCLO?

    I’ve never tried FCLO, but it is most suspicious that there is only one producer, who claims so much purity and precission. We have to scrutinize everything, one just can’t trust a salesman or a politician. We cannot even trust scientists, as they depend on salesmen and/or politicians.

    I know it hurts a lot to hear that one may have been had, and that one may have been recommending people something not-so-good. It is even more hurtful when one has given or done what is being criticised to your own family. How many cardiologists suffer the pain of hearing criticism to low-fat and low-salt diets after they have been recommending those interventions to many patients, even to brothers and sisters. We all suffer when we hear something awful.

    But, what if it turns out we are in error, and we choose remain in error?

    There’s people who claim that eating too much fruit will get you fat. There’s people who claim they eat a lot of fruit and are very slim (even dangerously slim). Some of the people who eat a lot fruit try to terrorize others by asserting as matter of fact that eating butter or lard will get you fat and cause a terrible heart attack. Some fat-eaters also commit the sin of terrorizing other people with the dreadful carbs. Terror is always wrong.

    We have to tread carefully, or all the good things will be contaminated by some silly mistake.

    August 26th, 2015 10:37 am Reply
  • Cheerios

    As a concerned WAPF follower, I want to know what really happened. Were Sally and Kaayla writing their book together and Kaayla would cringe in anger every time she caught a wiff of cinnamon tingle on Sally’s breath? So much so that she whipped out a report without going over her findings with her first? Did she storm off during certain points of the brainstorming and kick her own rear with her heals to temper her anger?
    Then we have this Dr who claims FCLO gave him heart damage though he imbibed the stuff like fine wine. It wasn’t the dosage, no, it was because it wasn’t a different brand.
    Somewhere Matt Stone is clapping his ultra warm flippers together with joy over this news while smiling with his Hamburgler grin. Any fish oil that goes down in flames is a good thing to him.
    Meanwhile his sidekick Garrett will probably blame this entire fiasco on potatoes polluting the minds of WAPF leadership.

    Note: I know none of these people personally. I buy their work on Amazon and admire their celebrity from afar.

    August 25th, 2015 10:44 pm Reply
  • Jenn

    I had never even heard of Dr. Daniel until this report came out. However, I have thought on many occasions, that I wish someone would give Dave Wetzel some competition. Force him to show more care for his clients who spend a fortune on his product. His website and customer service are terrible. He is rude, ignores questions, and is very vague about the contents of his products. I think we all should be concerned about his unwillingness to be honest and transparent. We are all about real food, honest labeling, knowing where our food comes from but we blindly support this man when he is unwilling to tell us what is in the products that our families are consuming? My question to Dave years ago was regarding essential oils in the products. Many people don’t believe adults or children should be consuming essential oils, but they are added to most of his products with no information about amounts or where the EO’s come from. He refused to answer my question. I still don’t know, so we stick to unflavored. I hope we can get some answers. I hope Dr. Daniel’s information turns out to be false, but perhaps this should remind us all not to blindly follow. We should all hold Dave Wetzel accountable. Maybe this should remind him to show more respect for his clients. We deserve honesty from him, and his recent blog post on this matter didn’t cut it. Maybe we should return all our FCLO and stop purchasing from Green Pastures until we have some answers.

    August 25th, 2015 10:04 pm Reply
    • Victor

      Seriuosly? Sorry, but I have a hard time believing you are a real user, as it is easy to verify that at least one of your claims is patently false:

      1. Dave Wetzel has more product information on his website than any company in the world. He blogs about FLCO, the processes, the nutritional analysis, and even the conversations with customers; some of which are available in audio format on his website. I’ve never seen anyone as transparent or informative.

      2. I have spoken with Dave on the phone and found him friendly and forthcoming. And I am an insignificant customer that has no special meaning to him, as I do not buy large volumes.

      Posts like this look an awful lot like astroturf – meaning that you are here to serve some agenda by derailing the conversation or misleading readers. If the product was truly bad, you would have stopped using it and forgotten about it long ago. If you are a real user, with real issues, we should be able to see some evidence of such somewhere on the web. Yet for years I have seen nothing but high praise for Green Pastures – until this report from Dr. Kaayla Daniel surfaced. (Except for the smell and taste).

      August 26th, 2015 4:27 am Reply
      • Jenn

        Hi Victor,

        No astroturf here, although I’m wondering the same about you since you are commenting on everyone’s post and referring to Dave Wetzel as a “hero” :) I believe there are many comments and bloggers(many hoping that none of these accusations are true), who still admit that Dave has NOT been transparent, gives very vague answers, or has not responded to their inquiries. Since you are so well informed on Dave’s process, Victor, can you give me the answer to my questions about essential oils in the products? I would really appreciate an insider’s opinion.

        August 26th, 2015 12:48 pm Reply
        • Victor

          Hi Jenn,

          OK, so you do have a valid inquiry about essential oils, and those specific details are not on the website, as far as I can see. I will gladly try to get more information about that for you (although, I am not an insider, so I am not sure when I can get this info yet).

          I can understand your frustration Jenn, but I do not think it warrants your comments, as Dave is still more transparent than any other such company. Please consider that this is a small family farm, and also consider the enormous amount of information that he does post on the website. We can see that he makes great effort to keep us informed on every detail of the products and his thought process.

          Also consider that the essential oils are optional, and not part of the core products (though they are almost everywhere, as you point out). Nor are they relevant to the topic under debate. I do not mean to belittle your concern; however, I feel we have a far larger issue here at the moment, and perhaps some people are bandwagoning or otherwise being incited to riot, so to say.

          Remember too that the high volume of information on Green Pasture’s website is not only from Dave Wetzel, but from numerous other doctors and experts in the field of health and nutrition.

          Nobody is perfect, but we can see that Dave actively puts out information about the products, and so I am sure that we will be able to get discussions rolling about the essential oils. I will add my voice to yours and email him now, although I do not expect any answers until these larger issues are behind us.

          I hope my response has changed your perspective a bit.

          August 26th, 2015 7:21 pm Reply
          • Jenn

            Victor,

            I believe my concern about flavoring was valid a year ago(when I made numerous phone calls, emails and posted on Dave’s blog) and is quite relevant in the current conversation. What are we paying $50./8 oz bottle for? Is it cod or pollock? Is it pure CLO or is it trans fats? Why is silica used? What is used for the flavorings? How much is used? Where did it come from? How is it made? There are miles of comments stating that Dave has not been transparent about his process or sourcing(and so far… still isn’t responding to these questions, even though some very serious accusations were made against the contents of his product days ago). Why is it taking so long to tell us what is in the product and where it comes from?

            Before buying eggs, I ask my local farmer: Are they pastured? How often are the hens outside? Are they rotated between fields? Are they given supplemental feed? What is in it? Is it soy free? GMO free? How are the hens treated? He gladly answers these questions and he is a small family farm and I’m only paying him $3/dozen. We are paying $50/8 oz bottle of “FCLO” and we should have the right to know exactly what is in that bottle. We should not have to hound Dave with questions or search through his website. It should be clearly labeled on the bottle and clearly stated under product information on the website.

            August 27th, 2015 7:54 am
          • Jenn

            Victor,

            I believe my concern about flavoring was valid a year ago(when I made numerous phone calls, emails and posted on Dave’s blog) and is quite relevant in the current conversation. What are we paying $50./8 oz bottle for? Is it cod or pollock? Is it pure CLO or is it trans fats? Why is silica used? What is used for the flavorings? How much is used? Where did it come from? How is it made? There are miles of comments stating that Dave has not been transparent about is process or sourcing(and so far… still isn’t responding to these questions, even though some very serious accusations were made against the contents of is product days ago). Why is it taking so long to tell us what is in the product and where it comes from?

            Before buying eggs, I ask my local farmer: Are they pastured? How often are the hens outside? Are they rotated between fields? Are they given supplemental feed? What is in it? Is it soy free? GMO free? How are the hens treated? He gladly answers these questions and he is a small family farm and I’m only paying him $3/dozen. We are paying $50/8 oz bottle of “FCLO” and we should have the right to know exactly what is in that bottle. We should not have to hound Dave with questions or search through his website. It should be clearly labeled on the bottle and clearly stated under product information on the website.

            August 27th, 2015 8:46 am
    • elaine

      Jenn – I am much more inclined to agree with you. I have had nothing but terrible customer service from GP (even commented on Kitchen Stewardship’s blog back in 2010 about it!). I said back then that I wish he would get some competition and it might improve his business practices. We have sacrificed in other areas to purchase FCLO/BO for our family (and frankly, I see little results except heartburn, consitpation and a gall bladder that is very unhappy – all of this goes away when I discontinue ONLY the FCLO). GP’s responses and vague answers have done nothing to reassure me that this is a quality product. At this point, it seems like attaining accurate results and being more concerned about people’s health would be the most important thing – instead of contacting the lawyers. I have followed this blog and WAPF faithfully for many years and this has certainly given me pause as to who I will trust. You said it very well … I have been blindly following and I just want some honesty and transparency. I am left wondering if, indeed, the Emperor is wearing new clothes and I’ve been duped.

      August 29th, 2015 1:04 pm Reply
  • Chuck

    As someone who has fished for cod off the Maine coast I can tell you cod is loaded with parasites and worms. Yes, also in the livers. Some of those beggars are an inch long. It’s not uncommon to get a can of cod livers from Europe and finding worms in the liver. So whether the cod liver oil is fermented or extra virgin there is a very good chance you may be getting fermented parasites and worms or some parts of them in your extra virgin cod liver oil. I know, they will say we filter it out. I would like to hear from the experts on this.

    August 25th, 2015 6:30 pm Reply
    • Ellen

      Whoa!! way gross. Hopefully the processor would be able to sort clean livers from parasitic livers?

      Maybe another fisherman can chime in please?

      September 7th, 2015 3:36 pm Reply
  • renata

    cant wait to hear more i am a simple customer and have been in touch with WAPF, Sally and Daniel everyone on the loop answering questions. it makes me feel good people are not hidinbg but until this is solved I AM NOT TAKING any more cod liver oil….

    can’t wait to hear more how do I suscribe for this

    August 25th, 2015 5:25 pm Reply
  • Linda

    Sarah, Where does the fish come from? Does it come from Alaska? I’m scared of any fish or cod liver oil coming from Alaska because of the Fukushima radiation from Japan. Also, can you say what fish is used?

    Thanks.

    August 25th, 2015 5:05 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      Those are questions for GPP to verify and answer directly. At the time I visited the facilities 7 or so years ago (I actually wasn’t even blogging yet at that time!), the fish (cod) was obtained from the North Atlantic.

      August 25th, 2015 5:08 pm Reply
      • Heather

        From a Wikipedia web page (I know, they have their own issues).

        “In 1992 the Canadian Federal Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, John Crosbie, declared a moratorium on the Northern Cod fishery, which for the past 500 years had largely shaped the lives and communities of Canada’s eastern coast. The interplay between fishing societies and the resources which they depend on is obvious to almost any observer: fisheries transform the ecosystem, which pushes the fishery and society to adapt.[2] In the summer of 1992, when the Northern Cod biomass fell to 1% of its earlier level,[3] Canada’s federal government saw that this relationship had been pushed to breaking point, and declared a moratorium, ending the region’s 500-year run with the Northern Cod….”

        November 8th, 2015 4:02 pm Reply
  • Bonnie

    Sarah, I am disappointed. You should have taken the high road. Anyone involved directly with WAPF, or having a financial interest in WAPF or Green Pasture, should have the decency to recuse themselves of public comments until the promised response has been released from WAPF. I’m not saying you are wrong in your statement, just that you are wrong to have made it.

    August 25th, 2015 4:02 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      It was absolutely appropriate that I respond to the report as quickly as possible given that my readers were asking me to, this blog is completely independent of the WAPF and Kaayla directly challenged content on it relating to FLCO, and also because GPP is NOT a sponsor of this blog.

      Also, I do *not* sell GPP as part of my Chapter Leader duties either contrary to rumors that are circulating.

      August 25th, 2015 4:20 pm Reply
    • Victor

      I would agree with Sarah and go even further by saying that she has a duty to respond to her audience here, and as a member of WAPF. Additionally, if she said nothing, she would be complicit in her silence. Such a report, which goes against all previous reports, user experiences, expert advice, etc., cannot go unanswered by representatives in the community.

      “The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing.”
      Or good women 😉

      August 26th, 2015 4:41 am Reply
  • Carrie Hahn

    On blood level vitamin D testing….instead of attacking a product, why not consider that the serum blood level tests themselves may be inaccurate? Many people have commented here that they have lower vitamin D levels then before they started taking GPP….what if something more complex is going on here?

    Please read the following GPP blog post and comments from Dr. Louisa Williams:

    http://www.greenpasture.org/utility/showArticle/?ObjectID=7004&find=serum%20d%20levels&happ=siteAdministrator

    August 25th, 2015 12:57 pm Reply
    • Victor

      Superb point Carrie! So glad that you dug that up. Not only do you show how limited – even useless – testing is, but you also show how vast Dave Wetzel’s information is on the Green Pasture website. He is being judged by people that have less expertise than him. His information has been out on that website, and nobody has ever disagreed with him or the other experts that comment there.

      August 26th, 2015 4:49 am Reply
  • Jessica

    It saw Mr. Wenzel speak at a local WAP meeting. It was very interesting. The FCLO is not meant to be the be all end all miracle food supplement. It is healthy, but doesn’t supply everything for your body. He told a story about his child who took FCLO and was have teeth issues. The child needed more MINERALS to compliment the FCLO and the teeth improve. So if the FCLO alone is not helping you, maybe you are deficient in something else!

    August 25th, 2015 9:29 am Reply
  • Elena Carter

    I do not have a solid position on this issue but some things in this report do sound “fishy” to me, and this is my subjective opinion since I do not have all the facts to form an objective one.
    First of all, Dr. Schmid claims that he contracted heart disease from FCLO. How did he come to this conclusion? Heart disease usually has something to do with chronic inflammation, and chronic inflammation among other things may be due to excess sugar, a.k.a. carbohydrates or due to excessive consumption of polyunsaturated fats. Was his diet otherwise free from carbohydrates or any other polyunsaturated fats? And yes, taking 3tbs of any polyunsaturated fats per day may eventually lead to health issues. My body even reacts negatively to homemade mayo with monounsaturated olive oil (yet, I have no adverse reaction to very large quantities of butter).
    Rancidity is another interesting issue. To a degree, I think any polyunsaturated fat will go rancid fast, but usually it’s something that one can detect by smell. When I decided to remove all processed foods from my diet, for some time I still kept unopened packages and containers of previously purchased foods like chips, pretzels and mayo (full of soybean or corn oil and also full of preservatives). When I decided to finally discard them I opened those packages and was horrified by the smell of rancidity (even just past or near expiration date). You can’t miss that smell, even strong fermented fish smell can’t disguise rancidity, and my nose is extremely sensitive to things like that, yet, I have not detected any smell of rancidity in GP products.
    I can’t really testify for any benefits or lack thereof in GP oils because I have not been using them on a regular basis and have not noticed any difference and have not done any before/after tests. However, Dr. Daniel’s report looks like a smear campaign (I suspect some internal political war between Dr. Daniel and the leadership of W. Price Foundation) . Any vitamin/mineral supplement product taken in recommended doses would be useless at worst, yet I cannot imagine it being harmful.
    GP products are expensive and I would definitely like to see some reassurances that they are worth the money I spend on them, yet, I would not jump to any conclusions based on the report that throws around unsubstantiated claims and refuses to disclose information about their sources.

    August 25th, 2015 8:45 am Reply
  • Chuck

    Does anyone want to buy my 6 bottles of Green Pasture Cod Liver oil?
    Everyone here should read Dr. Ron Schmid’s website regarding cod liver oil.
    Two years ago I found the butter oil to be 75% butter wax and 25% ?
    I make my own butter oil. One pound of raw unheated June butter in the Northeast (cows eating 100% grass) will produce approximately the following. 7 ounces of butter wax, 4 ounces of milk solids, and 5 ounces of pure bright yellow butter oil that taste great.
    No need to buy butter oil. Just eat some good butter.
    The only thing bad about butter is if you drop some you could slip and hurt yourself.

    August 25th, 2015 8:08 am Reply
    • Amanda

      Which flavor FCLO do you have? and how long have you had them for?

      August 27th, 2015 6:59 pm Reply
    • Judy

      Sounds like you’re making ghee. My understanding is that butter oil is not the same thing as ghee. A bigger problem for me is the sale of RAW butter is illegal in my state.

      August 31st, 2015 5:14 pm Reply
  • Sarah

    I am just wondering if WAPF thinks the EVCLO is any good or not… because really, if it is ok, then it should just be added to their list of okay products and then people can choose for themselves based on price/taste/benefits/whatever.
    We have found WAPF principles very helpful and value Sally Fallon’s work immensely. I do however keep in mind that politics and so on can always play a background role and I do wonder, way back when, what happened regarding the break-off group of WAPF from the original Price-Pottenger foundation?

    August 25th, 2015 6:11 am Reply
  • Jaci

    The fact that Dr Daniel is the Vice-President of WAPF says something to me. Quotes from another story:

    “The fact that the accusation comes from Kaayla Daniel is revealing of just how deep the fissure over cod liver oil goes at WAPF. Daniel is the WAPF vice president, while Sally Fallon Morrell is its president. (Daniel is also on the board of the Farm-to-Consumer Legal Defense Fund.) The two are even co-authors of a book published earlier this year, Nourishing Broth.

    In her report, Daniel says she first became concerned about the integrity of the Green Pasture cod liver oil last summer, when she heard and read some of the same reports I referred to in my blog post of last October. But she says her efforts to get WAPF to investigate ran into a brick wall.

    “As I reeled in the evidence, I came to believe there was something seriously wrong with FCLO. I thought the Weston A. Price Foundation should get to the bottom of it, and advised Sally Fallon Morell that we needed to test the Green Pasture Fermented Cod Liver Oil product properly and not just rely on David Wetzel’s assurances and his testing. I expressed concerns to her and later to WAPF’s Board of Directors about probable rancidity and possible putrefaction, and said I was skeptical of data showing improbably high levels of Vitamin D2 in the product. I furthermore shared reports from clinicians who were finding severe Vitamin D deficiencies among some members who were regularly taking FCLO. As Vice President of WAPF, I felt the safety of our members and the credibility of the foundation were at stake.

    “In December 2014, WAPF’s Board of Directors voted against testing based on Sally Fallon Morell’s beliefs, David Wetzel’s assurances, and scientific data of limited and questionable value. I was strongly advised to relax, leave the science to people who could be ‘fair to Dave’ and to toe the FCLO line.

    “Instead I went underground and set out on my own to test FCLO at some of the world’s top laboratories.”

    She says her tests, at five independent labs in the U.S., Norway, and the Netherlands, confirmed her worst fears. “Lab tests indicate the Green Pasture Fermented Cod Liver Oil is rancid; putrid; low in the fat-soluble vitamins A, D and K; apparently diluted with a trans-fat containing vegetable oil — and not even from cod. We have reliable reports that the X-Factor Gold Butter Oil comes from Argentina, not the Great Plains, and it tests rancid as well. And contrary to Green Pasture’s advertising, Dr. Weston A. Price’s own words make it clear that these are not products he would ever have endorsed.”

    August 24th, 2015 11:49 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      Actually, the “fissure” isn’t deep at all. Dr. Daniel has stepped out on her own with this … no one else on the board agreed with her or her position on this and never did. The WAPF already tested the FCLO independently last year and it came back non-rancid. Why Dr. Daniel has chosen this path is head scratching.

      August 25th, 2015 8:08 am Reply
      • Steve

        Sarah,

        Can you give some more information about the testing that was done and posted on the WAPF website? I’m wondering why that lab was chosen, and who paid for the test, since unlike the reports in Dr. Daniel’s reports where the “client” was blacked out, there was no client information at all, which seemed strange. Do you know how the sample was obtained? In his rebuttal post of a few days ago, David quotes that same doctor, but the quote wasn’t in the report that WAPF posted, so I started getting curious. Is this a lab that he has used in the past?

        August 26th, 2015 10:09 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          The WAPF response will be coming out very soon, and it contains all of this info in great detail. The UK lab selected and paid for independently by the WAPF to test the FCLO for rancidity was NOT the same lab Dave uses to test each batch of his product. And, this UK lab was carefully chosen which is why the Board felt very comfortable voting 7-1 against further testing because we strongly felt the rancidity claims were groundless .. this info will all be contained in the response from the Foundation. The Board was not at all divided on this issue, I can assure you.

          August 26th, 2015 10:13 pm Reply
    • Carrie Hahn

      I was part of the small group that toured the GPP facility with Sarah and will continue to support GPP whose products have been a life saver for my family.

      There is A LOT more going on here than people know and I must make the following comments.

      Kaayla told me 5 years ago, when she stayed at my house, that she was unhappy with the decision that Sally Fallon made to publish her book, “The Whole Soy Story” in hardback, and felt that the decision to print in hardback vs paperback impacted the sales of this book. Similarly, Dr. Ron Schmidt share with several people at the last conference that he was displeased with editing choices that Sally made in his recent re-print of “The Untold Story of Milk.”

      Rosita has been directly attacking GPP since they launched their product by directly attacking fermented cod liver oil (GPP is still the only company producing it). I have lost a lot of respect for the people involved in this activity and many of them I have know for more than 10 years.

      Just as some people cannot eat night shades, or raw milk, kefir or kombucha, GPP FCLO may not be right for you, but that does not give anyone the right to viciously launch an attack of this magnitude. I literally had to stop reading Kaayla’s report because I was so disgusted by her vitriol. Thank you Sarah for pointing out the inaccuracies in her report because I could not read another word. I think the truth will come to light.

      August 25th, 2015 12:34 pm Reply
      • Victor

        Great points again Carrie. The behavior of Rosita in the market place is very telling to me, and is one reason that I cannot trust the EVCLO product. How does a company make such a polished effort to be so ‘pure and pristine’ with their website, and then spit venom at a company like Green Pasture? It makes no sense. Unless you are a predator. A wolf in sheep’s clothing. If Rosita really cared about customers and health, they would be singing the praises of Green Pasture. The world is certainly big enough for both of them.

        Dave Wetzel may not have the most beautiful website, but he certainly has the better products, and he certainly has contributed far more knowledge to the community.

        August 26th, 2015 5:24 am Reply
  • Susanne T.

    I have long been a member of the Weston Price Foundation, and have closely followed Dr. Price’s diet recommendations. For many years my family consumed a daily dose of fermented fish oil, but about four years ago, I found that I could no longer stomach this oil. It made me sick! When I switched to regular fish oil, from a very dependable source, I was fine. I’m not sure why this is so, but I tested it several times over. Maybe there is some truth to Dr. Daniel’s report.

    August 24th, 2015 10:17 pm Reply
  • mil

    I am reading the comments about person’s levels of vitamin d. If one relies on FCLO only for vitamin d then of course the levels will be low. No matter how good the quality of the FCLO is. The best vitamin d you can take is with the sun. It’s natural. Get outside and get some sun. Now in the winter months by all mean FCLO but in summer there is sun everywhere

    August 24th, 2015 9:58 pm Reply
  • Kim Schuette

    Sarah, thank you for this very clear and measured response to Dr. Daniel’s report. Your voice of sanity is greatly appreciated. Let’s move forward and resolve the controversy in a respectful and productive way!

    August 24th, 2015 9:37 pm Reply
  • Lisa Bonisa

    I’ve been regularly checking my son’s D levels for a few years now. His D was 24 while taking D3 drops then plunged to 13 while taking FCLO.

    There doesn’t seem to be any middle ground with FCLO. People either find it beneficial or in our case, worthless (but quite expensive). Personally felt better taking Carlson’s brand.

    August 24th, 2015 8:28 pm Reply
  • Jo

    I’ve gone through the “report” and I have not been thwarted from taking and giving my 5 year old son the FCLO we still have left, which will be a while as we don’t take it daily. I will hold off on recommending the products and will not continue to purchase if the accusations are true because I can’t support a business deliberately selling an inferior product, however the health benefits we’ve received from FCLO outweigh the purported “rancidity.”

    August 24th, 2015 6:31 pm Reply
  • Josh

    This is very poor form of Dr. Daniels. How WAPF handles their response will be very telling.

    I have been mildly curious about the new “extra virgin CLO” on the market. At first, they marketed themselves as something fresh and new (which it sounds to be) but not very long after their launch, they started pointing fingers at the fermented CLO crowd. Very poor form. If a product is really all that great, then it will build a following, because word will get around about it. It will have integrity, because it is a good product. But comparing your product to another one (by saying bad things about the other, even if they are true) is very poor business practices. If the EVCLO company is truly behind this, using Dr. Daniels as their front person, then I shall never consume their product because I would not want to be consuming their dirty mud-slinging methods.

    I have read *some* of Dr. Daniels reports. She brings up a few points I think are valid and worth further review. But her overall tone is one of criticism…leading the reader to particular conclusion. If one isn’t thinking for themselves, they may be swayed by her tone.

    The fact she blacks out the names of the labs basically removes any credibility to her report. Should she decide to re-publish with the names of the labs, she might gain some credibility back, but she has already damaged her reputation. She makes no explanation for why she does not choose to disclose the lab names.

    I also find it strange that the ENTIRE report is about the Green Pasture products. Why does she focus on GP products? Why does she care? Why not include other cod liver products?

    The whole hoo-haw she makes about “fermentation” is a distraction. She criticizes the FCLO as being fermented when it is not produced by lacto-fermentation. Anyone who has read any of Sandor Katz’s books (or any other book on fermented foods) knows that the word fermentation covers a lot of different methods, only some of which involve the use of lactic acid bacteria.

    While I will continue to use GP’s products, I would love to see other choices in the marketplace as for FCLO. I’m sure there is more than enough room for other companies to produce their own quality FCLO.

    August 24th, 2015 5:37 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I agree … without the labs being named, the report is worth little as nothing can be verified as true and accurate. If the labs had her sign nondisclosures to ensure withholding of their names in her “report”, this means the labs are either not confident in the accuracy of the results and/or the conclusions that Dr. Daniel comes to and thus are concerned about litigation.

      The UK lab that the WAPF used to independently test the FCLO is named in this document along with the results … complete transparency and it was written in Feb 2015: http://www.westonaprice.org/uncategorized/concerns-about-fermented-cod-liver-oil/

      August 24th, 2015 5:42 pm Reply
  • Rebecca

    This is very very sad. I hope it is cleared up soon. I feel terrible that I could have recommended such a product for so long and it not be what it claims to be. I pray this is false and the product proves to be what it has claimed to be.

    August 24th, 2015 5:17 pm Reply
  • Jame

    This controversy almost makes me happy because I hate taking FCLO. Some small voice in brain whispered, whoo hoo! But seriously I adore the foundation and hate to see infighting. As a small fringe group we have to stick together. It’s unsettling to watch the VP go off message.

    August 24th, 2015 4:43 pm Reply
  • Javier

    Polyunsaturated oils are VERY unstable, oxidizing quickly when exposed to oxygen, light and heat—even just sitting in a bottle, but also when they go into our bodies—and turning rancid. (including
    omegas) Also Fermented foods require a glucose source to create (metabolize) a by-product e.g. lactic acid that prevents the food from decomposing. The result is a pleasant sour taste that one would find with sauerkraut, pickles, yogurt, etc. Cod liver oil has no glucose and cod livers have very little glucose (mostly protein, fat, water and some minerals). The livers and the oil simply go from fresh to rancid in a short period of time. If left to continue decomposing the oil will become putrid leaving a foul smell and taste.

    Sadly, atlantic Cod is an over-fished and threatened species.

    Why not just eat more fish and liver and gain actual benefits since it’s a food source? People got to sell you something! Even the beloved WPF…My advice to ya’ll skip your expensive rancid oil!

    August 24th, 2015 4:41 pm Reply
    • Norwegian women

      Javier, I do not agree with you. I live in Norway, and I make my own cod liver oil by fermenting fresh cod liver. I have never, ever seen or smelled any signs of rancidity in my oil. Even after a year of storage. I’d like to add that my nose is extremly sensitive to fishy smells.

      August 25th, 2015 11:01 am Reply
      • Jean

        I am very curious about your process for fermenting cod liver. Do you add anything to the livers? Is it aerobic or anaerobic? How do you store it once it is fermented?

        August 25th, 2015 7:24 pm Reply
    • STG

      Totally agree! Real food.

      August 25th, 2015 12:37 pm Reply
  • Elizabeth

    When Kaayla Daniel brands herself as The Naughty Nutritionist, people of good hearts assume she means it in a playful way. Then you watch her videos, listen to her speak, and feel uncomfortable, even disgusted. And then there’s the awful realization that Kaayla Daniel does not have good intent, but has wheeled her Trojan Horse into WAPF.

    August 24th, 2015 4:28 pm Reply
    • Amanda

      Well said! These are my feelings exactly.

      August 27th, 2015 7:11 pm Reply
  • Krissy

    We have taken FCLO, butter oil, and skate oil for years (probably close to 6 years). Recently my husband and I had our vitamin D levels, both were in the low 20’s. Really low:(

    August 24th, 2015 3:51 pm Reply
    • Jennifer

      I can say the same for myself and my husband–low D levels. But, we were also taking 5000 IU’s of vitamin D along with the FCLO. This caused me to question, was it the FCLO/vitamin D, or was it my body’s inability to absorb it??

      So, I added in bile salts to help emulsify the fat (Chapman reflex points did show gallbladder inflammation) to better absorb. Tested again in 6 months and my husband’s D went from 19 to 49 and mine went from 33 to 83. BINGO!

      Liver congestion and gallbladder inflammation is rampant–even in our kiddos due to the high fructose/sugar consumption to the constant stress (emotional and physical stress) that produces systemic inflammation. And for those that have had their gallbladder removed, bile salts should be a regular part of their supplement intake–takes pressure off the liver and acts as their new gallbladder.

      I have seen this result 100% of the time with those that follow the recommendations.

      I am a WAP Chapter leader and would like more specific and transparent information on this subject. With all the finger pointing and in-fighting with WAP in recent years, my gut told me that this may be driven by ulterior motives, which is even more of a reason to get honest, straight-forward answers from both sides.

      I have seen only good results with my patients and family from taking this product. We didn’t even have to use sunscreen this summer since optimizing our D levels due to better absorption and we are no longer taking added D supplements, just FCLO, and D levels remain in the 50-70 range (therapeutic range). We will check again in the winter to see if they remain constant without as much sun.

      August 25th, 2015 10:40 am Reply
      • Catherine

        How would you know if you need bile salts? I’ve not had problems with a fishy aftertaste when taking the capsules so maybe I’m digesting the fat appropriately?

        August 25th, 2015 5:50 pm Reply
      • Nancy

        Thank you for this information about bile salts and vitamin D!

        August 26th, 2015 1:41 am Reply
  • Joanie Blaxter

    As a WAPF chapter leader, it seems to me that, really, the only way to settle this controversy fully is to compare apples to apples in terms of test results. So why doesn’t the Foundation simply pay to have a second round of testing done at the same five labs that Kaayla Daniel used? With full publication to the membership of the results as well as the names of the labs to ensure 100% transparency.

    August 24th, 2015 3:50 pm Reply
    • Joanie Blaxter

      Correction: that would be 10 labs that Dr. Daniel used, not 5.

      August 25th, 2015 11:16 am Reply
    • Amanda

      Well, in order for that to be possible we would first need to know which labs Daniel used for testing… and she isn’t telling us.

      August 25th, 2015 2:13 pm Reply
  • Rhianna

    Putrid is as putrid tastes. Maybe the Emperor really has no clothes on for this one.

    August 24th, 2015 3:34 pm Reply
  • Christine Hazard

    I was taking Green Pastures Cod Liver oil and I had my Vitamin D levels checked by my NP and they came back extremely low (10). So, I have stopped taking it. Just wanted to let everyone know.

    August 24th, 2015 3:11 pm Reply
    • E

      Look at Jennifer’s comment just above… very interesting. Problem was solved apparently.

      September 8th, 2015 6:06 pm Reply
      • E

        And I think FCLO was supposed to be for vitamin A mostly, not so much D…

        September 8th, 2015 6:09 pm Reply
  • Mary

    Haha! Maybe they don’t know the difference of smell between fermentation and rancidity. They’re probably buying rancid, yellow olive oil from Walmart and other grocery stores.

    I used regular CLO when we were treating my son’s autism. He was on quite a bit of it. After I heard about Green Pastures (I had already learned some things about WAP) I started giving him the fermented CLO with butter oil and we had wonderful results on his labs, which were tested every 6 months AND he was taking less per day.

    August 24th, 2015 2:47 pm Reply
  • Elle

    I’m grateful for the dialogue. I called Green Pastures last year concerned about the smell and taste of the expensive bottle of High Vitamin Butter Oil that I had purchased. They said it was fine, normal, and had a long shelf-life. It seemed rancid to me so I tried it once more and stopped that as well as the FCLO.

    August 24th, 2015 2:31 pm Reply
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  • Andrew

    I’m done with Green Pasture products. Very disappointing.

    August 24th, 2015 2:22 pm Reply
  • Susie

    Sarah, Thank you so much for this post. I was really shook up by it all as i have about $200 worth of FCLO/BO in my fridge and am probably pregnant. After reading the report I was scared to take it. After reading this i think i will just keep taking it and really listen to my body about whether it likes it or is revolting it. We, too, have had great results from taking it…Thanks again!

    August 24th, 2015 2:15 pm Reply
  • Crystal

    I wrote dave a year ago with a question about fclo. His answer was vague and when I asked for clarification it was met with crickets on his end. I’m not holding my breath for a lengthy explanation from him about the current situation at hand. If it’s true then there will be a law suit going I’m sure bc I, like many others, have about $200 stocked in my fridge of this stuff and well over triple that in past purchases.
    If it’s false….well let’s just say either way someone is gonna be screwed!
    I would’ve hoped for a response already from dave which I find to be quite off putting. If it were my company that was being questioned id come out with guns a’blazing EVEN IF my customer service skills sucked to the high heavens!

    August 24th, 2015 2:02 pm Reply
    • Jenn

      I, too, have always found Dave and his staff to be rude and extremely vague when answering questions, if they are answered at all. I’ve always wished another company would come along and give him some competition because I never felt great about supporting them. Returns are allowed within 30 days. If we all return the $200. worth of products in our refrigerators, perhaps he’ll start being more open and honest.

      August 25th, 2015 9:28 pm Reply
  • Monica

    I read over the report and I was not convinced of its truthfulness. To be a Ph.D and to not know the types of cod then go on to say that since its pollock and not cod, which is a type of cod, is just laughable. It’s embarrassing.
    I have no idea how the product is made. I do know that animal flesh can be salt preserved as well as fat preserved without being rancid.
    This is just survivalist 101 knowledge.

    With this said, some people do have problems with FCLO. I had extreme histimine sensitivity after moving out of a rental that began to leak and get mold. I couldn’t tolerate FCLO at that time among other things. It would burn my throat, give me acne and some other things.

    I just kept drinking Kombucha after moving out and ate food very fresh after cooking it instead of making extra and reheating leftovers. I cut gluten out for awhile and I healed just fine while taking dessicated liver and getting plenty of sunlight. I live in FL, so that’s easy.

    My histimine intolerance passed. I was able to take it once again. I personally don’t take it daily, but a few times a week. I take it more during the months postpartum after having a baby and recovering after the bleeding has stopped.

    When I take it I do notice better eyesight, glowing skin, sparkly eyes and a happy thyroid. I’m not getting rid of mine.

    August 24th, 2015 1:24 pm Reply
    • Three Pipe Problem

      Except that pollock is *not* a kind of cod. It’s from the Cod family, genetically (Gadidae). Saying that pollock is a kind of cod because it’s from Gaidae (the “cod family”) makes about as much sense as saying that cauliflower is a kind of mustard, because it’s from the mustard family. (Which is none.)

      August 24th, 2015 5:50 pm Reply
      • Terry

        Cod is the common name for the genus Gadus. Some species that also belong to the genus Gadus are not called cod. Case in point, Alaska pollock. Pollock is a cod fish; being called Pollock does not mean it is genetically distinct, scientifically. Common names can be misleading and not necessarily an index of scientific rigour.

        August 25th, 2015 11:46 am Reply
        • Three Pipe Problem

          Terry, I’m familiar with taxonomy. The problem with your argument — that a common genus somehow makes pollock cod — is the same problem I mentioned above with saying a common family does so.

          Pollock is not a cod. I spent half an hour looking for *one source* stating that pollack is a kind of cod. Some sources mention the relationship, but no source seems to indicate that a pollock is a cod. Just as one example, the Wikipedia page on Pollock doesn’t mention Cod.

          Nowhere on the At-Sea Processors association is pollock described as a kind of cod; they are always listed as separate species. They do state that, “Pollock is a whitefish similar to cod.”

          Fishwatch.gov states that “Pollock are managed along with other bottom-dwelling species such as cod, […]”

          Terry, invoking “science” as being too complicated for people to understand seems like a partisan attempt at confusion to em. The science behind what is a cod fish and what isn’t… it’s not controversial. It’s not too confusing for people to understand, as you suggest. A pollock is not a cod.

          August 26th, 2015 12:24 pm Reply
          • Steve

            According the FDA, “cod” is not an acceptable marketplace name for pollock of any kind. So while you might be right in saying that it is commonly though of as a cod, it cannot be labeled such.

            August 26th, 2015 10:12 pm
  • John S. Levinson

    Clearly, an important disagreement on the Board of Directors of the Weston A Price Foundation has broken out into the public domain concerning the contents, and the quality of the Green Pasture Cod Liver.

    First, it should be clearly stated that that The Weston A Price Foundation has come to an important cross roads. The Weston A Price Foundation has over the years built a huge base of TRUST within and outside of it membership. This base of TRUST is so strong that I think it would be safe to say that just about any recommendation that the Weston A Price Foundation makes has immediate credibility both inside and outside it membership.

    Because of this enormous base of TRUST, the WAPF has been able to attract “sponsors” that contribute large amounts of money to the WAPF in exchange for an “Official Endorsement” of these specific products by the WAPF.

    If my understanding is correct, the number one level of sponsorship for the WAPF is the “GOLD SPONSOR”. That is to say, GOLD Sponsors give the most amount of money to the WAPF. And, if I understand correctly Green Pasture IS one of the FEW GOLD Sponsors. And, in exchange for the sponsorship fees paid by Green Pasture, the Weston A Price Foundation GIVES it’s HIGHEST LEVEL OF ENDORSEMENT. And, this WAPF Endorsement of Green Pasture products is strongly communicated to all of its members

    This arrangement is all well and good as long as no questions of QUALITY, RELIABILITY or SAFTEY arise. BUT, the moment any such questions arise / become a part of the public domain, IMMEDIATELY THERE IS A QUESTION OF CONFLICT OF INTEREST on the part of the Weston A Price Foundation. WHY? Because the WAPF has taken money in exchange for their endorsement. THERE IS NO GETTING AROUND THIS FACT!

    Anything that any member of the WAPF Board of Directors says or states concerning Green Pasture products is CLEARLY a CONFLICT OF INTEREST. And as such, a huge public relations disaster! Hundreds, if not thousands and thousands of WAPF members and their friends are now ACTIVELY questioning BOTH the credibility of the Weston A Price Foundation and their FINANCIAL PARTNER (GOLD SPONSOR), Green Pasture. This is indeed a CREDIBILITY DISASTER for an organization that is founded on credibility.

    WHAT CAN YOU DO? WHAT MUST YOU DO?

    1. The WAPF Board of Directors MUST, in unison, inform their members and the public that they will immediately select TWO highly reputable, independent laboratories to test the Green Pasture products in question.

    2. These two test laboratories MUST obtain their product samples from out in
    the market place and NOT directly from Green Pasture directly. The fact is,
    an highly rated independent laboratory knows exactly how to obtain the
    product test samples.

    3. The WAPF MUST, at all cost , AVOID the “Coca Cola Syndrome” and
    insure that the TWO test laboratories are NOT influenced in any way by
    the WAPF or Green Pasture.

    4. Obtain the services of a TOP Pubic Relations firm to guide you through this
    situation / problem and to make SURE that the WAPF does not damage its
    incredible reputation. I am sure that this would include informing your
    membership and the public of exactly what you are doing and then, say no
    more until the results of BOTH testing laboratories are completed.

    I would make it a goal to complete this independent laboratory testing by
    31 October 2015 and as such, be in a position to announce the results of the TWO independent testing laboratories at the Weston A Price Wise Traditions Conference in November 2015.

    August 24th, 2015 1:22 pm Reply
    • Sally

      AMEN

      August 24th, 2015 6:40 pm Reply
    • PJ

      Yes, this is exactly spot on.

      August 24th, 2015 8:07 pm Reply
    • Kelly

      Agreed

      August 25th, 2015 8:55 am Reply
    • Jean

      John S. Levinson, I am also concerned about Green Pastures monetary sponsorship of WAPF and conflict of interest. I like you ideas for a new set of independent lab tests.

      August 25th, 2015 11:11 am Reply
    • Sharon D.

      Amen to that! I had my suspicions at first, it’s always at the back of my mind as to why only the GP brand is heavily promoted on various WAPF blogs. Ofcourse, being the sheep, I follow blindly. Thank you for your clear explanation. Hope they take note & proceed as suggested. We want unbiased independent lab test.

      August 25th, 2015 11:36 am Reply
    • janieinMN

      BEST course of action!

      August 25th, 2015 1:24 pm Reply
    • Erika

      Totally agree!

      August 25th, 2015 4:40 pm Reply
    • Jim

      Spot on! Thank you for such a great comment.

      August 25th, 2015 8:41 pm Reply
      • Augie

        No professional association should recommend any one product over another. WAPF should just recommend FCLO in general as well as raw milk, coconut oil etc but not brands. I am familiar with many professional or trade associations and they stay far away from the dangerous practice of recommending a particular brand. Let the brands buy advertisement and floor space to generate revenues. This avoids situations like this

        August 26th, 2015 5:29 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          The problem with that Augie is that so many CLO brands on the market are industrialized with synthetic Vitamin A and D added and should not be consumed. If you look at the WAPF CLO brand recommendation page, there are 4 brands listed under “Best” which I think gives people plenty of room to choose which one works best for them. http://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/cod-liver-oil-basics-and-recommendations/#brands

          August 26th, 2015 6:25 pm Reply
  • Brian Klein

    Thank you for your thoughts on this! This will be a story I follow closely moving forward.

    One thing I cannot help but notice is that many have commented that they are not testing with high levels of vitamin D after taking this product. In my understanding, the main reason for taking FCLO is preformed vitamin A, and the D included is helpful, but not sufficient to increase one’s levels. (please correct me if I am wrong.) I also remember Sally Fallon saying that you can take too much FCLO, and to be judicious in the quantities, so getting proper amounts of vitamin D when using a product inherently low in vitamin D judiciously will not help one’s vitamin D levels. I might suggest that they try and get more sun time, and if that isn’t possible, find a different D3 supplement to help increase your vitamin D levels.

    August 24th, 2015 1:15 pm Reply
  • Elizabeth

    While I was on Green Pasture’s FCLO/butter oil blend, my lipid peroxide level was elevated out of range. Despite a scrupulous diet and lifestyle, I had a couple other cardiac warning markers that simply didn’t make any sense at all. Foods can indeed be responsible for causing such issues. I have switched to Rosita FCLO (Norway) and Organic3’s Extra Virgin Butter Oil (USA) and will be re-testing in a few months. I would advise all consumers to monitor their blood for lipid peroxides, inflammatory markers, and vitamin D level. I worry about all the children taking cod liver oil if indeed there is a rancidity problem. You may not see any effect in their health now, but it is not wise for them to have their blood vessels exposed to any rancid oils potentially found in cod liver oil. (This is why we also don’t serve them refined seed oils anymore!) Many parents are feeding their children a nutrient dense diet regardless of CLO supplementation, and thus their children are not getting sick as often, so it is difficult to attribute their health specifically to CLO. As for the vitamin D2 issue, no one should ever assume that simply taking a teaspoon of cod liver oil is sufficient for them, when we may potentially have absorption issues and/or genetic mutations that can hinder our assimilation and metabolism of these supplements. Getting out in the sun should be the preferred mode of “supplementation” whenever possible since the ideal form of vitamin D production occurs in our skin. By the way, I have been in touch with Dave about the source of his cacao powder used in his chocolate cream flavor, to see if he has verified the absence of heavy metals, but he has not. I’m disappointed in him for that. If anyone is unaware of the contamination of most cacao powders, you’re looking at cadmium, lead, and more. Buyer beware.

    August 24th, 2015 12:55 pm Reply
  • Joanie Blaxter

    All of this controversy could possibly be very easily laid to rest if the Foundation simply funded third party testing to see if the results are similar to what Kaayla has produced. The names of the labs would NOT be blacked out which would guarantee total transparency.

    As a WAPF chjapter leader, I hope that all of us who are members and chapter leaders should call upon the WAPF board to insist that this happens as quickly as possible.

    August 24th, 2015 12:54 pm Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      The WAPF HAS DONE THIS. http://www.westonaprice.org/uncategorized/concerns-about-fermented-cod-liver-oil/

      The third party lab testing by the UK in this link was paid for by the WAPF. The results came back that the FCLO was not rancid and was very healthful.

      August 24th, 2015 5:28 pm Reply
      • Deborah Gordon

        Hi Sarah, thanks for your response: reminding us of the benefits we have experienced. However, the benefits some have received, along with the non-rancid lab tests, don’t answer the finding of high acidity and free fatty acids – the testing for more advanced rancidity – cited in Dr. Daniels’ work. Starting with Dr. Price and carrying through to modern scientific literature: taking rancid oil is worse than no oil at all.
        I look forward to a response from Green Pastures about the measures of advanced rancidity, and great, Dr. Daniels can reveal the names of the testing labs to assure their status.
        I have asked Sally if she would consider inserting a public discussion between Dr D and Dave Wetzel at the Wise Traditions conference. It would be hard to attend without paying attention to this matter if it is still unresolved at that point.
        I have never considered FCLO to be a source of vitamin D and have supplemented that separately, but had hoped it was a good source of omega 3 fatty acids. My omega 3 index was low recently, despite a well-balanced diet and nearly a decade of FCLO. Which could mean the omega 3’s were low, OR that they were overpowered by trans fats (not in my diet, except butter) or omega 6’s (certainly present to some degree in FCLO) or lost in a battle with rancidity.
        I’m refraining for now, until this is resolved, thanks for looking into it for all of us.
        Deborah Gordon

        August 25th, 2015 10:38 am Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          Check out Chris Kresser’s analysis just posted … he says that lipid scientists would disagree with Kaayla’s interpretation of the labs. chriskresser.com/important-update-on-cod-liver-oil/

          August 25th, 2015 3:15 pm Reply
      • Mariya Dolgopolova

        Sarah, I have been reading your posts for several years with great benefit. I have to disagree on the issue of FCLO. All this sounds very much like vaccine science. And if it does turn out that WAPF was ignoring warning signs to keep the money flowing, which is very likely given David’s incoherent mumbling and the near impossibility of fermenting livers, the trust of many will be lost not only for the WAPF but for you as well.

        August 25th, 2015 10:58 am Reply
        • Athena

          “the trust of many will be lost not only for the WAPF but for you as well.”

          Waving around one single lab test “we did it, we did it” doesn’t convince or impress anyone with experience in sample collection and lab analysis. It simply will not hold up in court nor in the judgement of the public. In my mind it is already calling into question many statements made on your blog, which is a shame for any person with health issues desperately seeking help.

          September 15th, 2015 9:38 am Reply
  • Diane

    this could explain my recent blood results that showed transfat. There should have been NO reason for me having transfat in my blood. I was also remarkably low in vitamin D. While I have not been sick with viruses, I think I will stop taking this product until more testing has been completed because I believe the transfats are making some chronic conditions worse.

    August 24th, 2015 12:48 pm Reply
  • Sara

    Thank you for this. I appreciate your perspective. I am eagerly awaiting the Foundation’s official response to this, as I know many others are.

    August 24th, 2015 12:34 pm Reply
  • Meg

    I’m really looking forward to WAPF’s response on this matter. I have noticed that even when I take fclo religiously, my vitamin D levels seem to stay below the recommended range, so I have had some concerns over that. However, I’m not short-sighted enough to think that it could be testing methods, etc., and I know that it is a natural product, so there will be some variability on the vitamin D levels in each bottle. The high D2 levels are obviously a concern, but if that is the case for all cod liver oils on the market then I don’t think GP should bear the brunt.
    However, I would really like these questions to get answered since these fat soluble vitamins are essential for growing children. Our children can’t help what we give them, and I need to know that I’m doing what’s best for them. I have noticed that there have been more complaints of constipation on the wapf formula in the last several years (and this is something that I have actually discussed with Sally–she said that this used to not be an issue). Could the change in the recommended clo be the reason?

    August 24th, 2015 12:28 pm Reply
  • Heather

    Where do you find the correct dosage for how much CLO a child or adult should be taking daily when trying to heal tooth decay? I don’t plan to switch our family but in trying to heal one of our children’s teeth, it has felt like a guessing game as to how many CLO/butter oil, activator x, and/or skate liver oil capsules to give her. Our youngest takes the liquid form so I use that label to determine how many capsules everyone should “normally” take. I need a “dosage chart” for everyday vs healing protocol.

    I’m also curious about the Activator-X mention. If the high vitamin butter oil isn’t what Weston Price meant, what was the activator X he discussed?

    At present, I have no plans to stop using their products. I’d feel at a loss to turn anywhere else when we are doing all we can to help our (1 of 5 children) daughter’s teeth heal.

    August 24th, 2015 12:22 pm Reply
    • Sara

      Heather, we’re in the exact same boat. My kids are also currently trying to heal tooth decay. Reading how harmful 1.5 tsp. a day might potentially be has me wondering if I am doing the right thing? I want more than anything to heal my kids teeth naturally and we’ve seen lots of success stories on The Healthy Home Economist, but is the FCLO/Butter Oil mix the right thing for our treasured ones? Is there any other option in healing tooth decay? I hope these questions are answered soon!

      August 25th, 2015 12:04 am Reply
      • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

        1.5 tsp a day is fine. Dr. Ron took 1-3 TABLESPOONS per day which is 3-9 teaspoons. And, he took this much for DECADES. Very much poor judgment on his part!

        August 25th, 2015 8:11 am Reply
        • Flossie

          Didn’t something similar happen to Dr. Mercola — overdoing it on the cod liver oil? And now that I think of it, wasn’t Dr. Daniel engaged to Dr. Mercola for a short time? No nuptials, evidently.

          August 25th, 2015 5:06 pm Reply
        • Susan

          3 tablespoons is about 1/4 cup. That’s a lot of fat to drink every day, to say nothing about the excess Vitamin A!

          August 25th, 2015 7:39 pm Reply
          • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

            Not to mention far too many polyunsaturates no matter what the form is … very very unhealthy to consume polyunsaturates at this high level even in the form of cod liver oil.

            August 25th, 2015 9:27 pm
      • Judy

        Ben Hewitt discusses tooth decay in his latest book “Nourishing Homestead”, on pgs 86-87. In addition to sugar, phytate rich foods are also a major culprit and must be treated traditionally to reduce phytic acid. He refers readers to WAPF website for more info.

        August 31st, 2015 5:25 pm Reply
  • Heather

    I DO wish I had seen some of the health transformations that I hear from others, but the FCLO we take diligently each morning (along with the butter oil) is one of those things we do because it must be good for us– not because we can tell any difference. In fact, in the same time period that we started these I have battled leaky gut, and hormone imbalance. I too will wait for more info before deciding though.

    August 24th, 2015 11:40 am Reply
  • Kelly L.

    Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts. Please keep us updated with this story as it unfolds.

    August 24th, 2015 11:28 am Reply
  • Megan Carter

    Thanks so much for your response, Sarah! I wholeheartedly agree with you. I am very uncomfortable with how Dr. Daniels went about releasing this information. She lost a lot of credibility in my eyes by not going to Mr. Wetzle first and allowing him to respond; very unprofessional. What upsets me the most is what all this hype is going to do to his business even if everything turns out to be completely unfounded. Anyone who has met him can verify that he is extremely transparent and open about what he does or does not know. I have had amazing results from taking GP FCLO and even being 26 weeks pregnant I do not intent to discontinue use.

    August 24th, 2015 11:27 am Reply
    • Sandy

      I totally agree with you Megan! Thanks Sarah for taking the time! I’m not changing a thing. Green pastures infusion or any other product is superior to any other product in my eyes. This is not convincing to me either. Just lots of hot air to boost their agenda/product/ego.

      August 24th, 2015 4:58 pm Reply
    • Rita

      Very irresponsible! Even as you feel this way, which you have a right, you do not have the right to risk the health of your child. How about ‘better be safe than sorry’? Why not find other food sources of d and a until there is a final answer on this product?

      August 26th, 2015 9:56 am Reply
  • Sarah, The Healthy Home Economist

    This email just hit my inbox from a lady who is confounded by this controversy ….

    Hi Sarah,

    Thank you very much for your post on this issue. I have been getting emails from friends and clients in an absolute frenzy. I was quite suspect when I saw the recommendation for the other EVCLO — follow the money. I was thinking that it was time for a new endorsement for a new product and a disparaging article on an old to fuel the economic driven race for health – yes, even in this “traditional” world of ours. my unfortunate take on this is that someone is getting paid to raise the profile of another CLO while slamming an old one that should let go of it’s grip in a “well oiled” community. If I’m out of line, please forgive my honesty but I see this as another fine example of capitalism and hard ball marketing in a time fueled by fear of chronic disease and a captive audience. I find it very sad.

    I hope you and yours are going really well and thanks again for being a sober voice of reason seemingly unmotivated by making the big bucks off of a trusting community of loyal consumers.

    August 24th, 2015 11:21 am Reply
    • Dave

      It does remind me of the sham “scientific” studies done so often to justify some new chemical/drug that Big Pharma wants to sell us. It’s a reminder that even in the natural health world, one must follow the money very carefully and be aware of those shady motivations. Of course, that goes on both sides, and we’ll see how this plays out.

      August 24th, 2015 1:19 pm Reply
    • kathleen S.

      I would like to follow the money trail here. Who in WAPF is financially benefiting from Green Pastures Fermented Cod Liver Oil? I have used it for 10 years, and I am angry about what is going on. This oil is extremely expensive and we have sacrificed to be able to buy it. My heart started to have irregular beats about 5 yrs. ago despite being a “WAPF poster child”, drinking raw milk, bone broth, no foods that are GMO or conventional, pastured eggs etc. This story is so alarming and distressing as I no longer feel I trust Sally Fallon, or WAPF. To think that this cod liver oil might have trans fats in it behooves me.

      August 24th, 2015 3:25 pm Reply
      • Leah

        What do you mean it behooves you?

        August 25th, 2015 1:11 pm Reply
    • Jena

      Those were my thoughts exactly.

      With the spread of traditional cooking I would imagine FCLO is a fast growning business. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a new FCLO brand emerge in the next few years.

      Thanks for the great rebuttle, Sarah!

      August 24th, 2015 5:04 pm Reply
    • Nicola

      As nice as this email sounds, it frustrates me because he does not actually answer any of the allegations in Dr. Daniels report at. all. Why can’t he release a statement notifying people as to whether they use transfats and what the fermentation process is, etc, etc. Many people have spent literally hundreds on his products, the least he can do is tell us what is in them and how they are made! In addition, I am quite sure he pays money to WAPF as a spondor, so the accusations he hurls at Dr. Daniels as being possibly financially motivated (which he has no proof of), in fact do apply to his own situation with WAPF!!! Smoke and mirrors tactics – Mr. Wetzel, please just address questions people want answered about your product.

      August 25th, 2015 8:12 am Reply
      • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

        This email is not from David Wetzel, it is from a reader who emailed me her thoughts! Here is the GPP response: http://www.greenpasture.org/utility/showarticle/?eid=4189&usid=bbf56e1b1fbee171076926f61035cd5b&objectID=9336

        August 25th, 2015 8:47 am Reply
      • Carrie Hahn

        I believe we will see in time that there is an alliance between Dr. Daniels and Rosita. I know of a personal alliance that I cannot disclose at this time. Additionally, Dr. Schmidt has already stated that he has switched from GPP to Rosita. And BTW, Rosita is also a donor to the WAPF.

        August 25th, 2015 12:51 pm Reply
    • LisaIngram

      The email said exactly what I thought when I first read Sarah’s post about this issue. This is Bernays style propaganda to get knee jerk lemming reactions from people who desperately want the best health they can have. It’s sad. They move us about with their versions of “shock and awe” instead of hard hitting truth. There is a difference in the two.

      August 26th, 2015 10:59 am Reply
  • Elle

    I am going to quit taking the product because some of what her report said, resonated with me. MY dealings with Dave have not been the best. He does not seem to like to be transparent and truthfully my Vit D levels were sooooo low, even after taking the FCLO for a year. We all have our personal beliefs about these things and need to listen to what our gut is telling us.

    August 24th, 2015 11:09 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I agree! If something else works for you better, then by all means take it!

      August 24th, 2015 11:12 am Reply
  • Shirley B

    With everything that has happened in the last few months to (Drs being found dead) I am highly suspicious of this report as well. There is no end to what big pharma will do to keep us from being healthy without their poison! Everyone has their price.

    August 24th, 2015 11:07 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      There are a number of undercurrents in play in this story that I am not at liberty to discuss. I very much would if I could. The word here is caution and skepticism given that the labs aren’t named, the data cannot be verified and other issues which point to the possibility of data contamination.

      August 24th, 2015 11:10 am Reply
      • PJ

        Than as a board member yourself, please, open up a transparent and CURRENT investigation. I am sure the monies can be raised for the testing.

        August 24th, 2015 12:13 pm Reply
    • watchmom3

      Yes, Shirley, that is exactly what I thought. I appreciate Sarah’s logical and reasonable delineation of reasons to tread slowly, and judiciously. Rumors are destructive. God bless those who seek the Truth.

      August 24th, 2015 12:17 pm Reply
  • Victor

    Dave Wetzel is an absolute hero, and the most transparent producer I have ever seen. He has tons of extensive information on his website with regard to every minute detail about his products. The knowledge that he displays – and shares – is truly extraordinary.

    Like others here, I have experience first hand the magic of Green Pasture products. The impact on my teeth is immediate and beyond question. Indeed, the proof is in the pudding, and no amount of false claims from Dr. Daniel will ever change my opinion of Green Pasture and Dave Wetzel.

    Sadly, I have lost all respect for Dr. Daniel, and she is someone that I have listened to often on podcasts and such, and had considered her a trusted source of knowledge. No more. Her report is unforgivable, and is clearly driven by ulterior motives.

    August 24th, 2015 10:55 am Reply
  • Nevlyn

    Thanks for your comments Sarah. I value your unbiased opinion and will keep taking the cod liver oil. It will be interesting to see how the report plays out,

    August 24th, 2015 10:49 am Reply
    • Andrew

      Sarah is anything but unbiased in this situation

      August 24th, 2015 4:38 pm Reply
      • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

        Actually, Green Pasture Products is NOT a sponsor of this blog. If you mean by biased that I respect the company and use the products, then that is true. However, I am not paid or sponsored in any way by David Wetzel for my opinions on his product line.

        August 25th, 2015 5:05 pm Reply
        • Jim

          But your blog is linked on Green Pasture’s website…

          August 27th, 2015 3:02 pm Reply
          • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

            Any link I have on this blog to the Green Pasture Products website is a non-affiliate link. In fact, Green Pasture Products doesn’t even have an affiliate program!

            August 27th, 2015 3:38 pm
  • lynn

    thank you~!

    August 24th, 2015 10:47 am Reply
  • John Delmolino / Traditional Health First / Amherst, MA.

    Sarah, your response is exactly what I have been pondering in my mind since reading Dr. Daniel’s Friday night published E book? There are exactly two sides to every story and I do know that well having retired from the Massachusetts State Police 20 years ago. Serving as a detective for over 6 years I know all to well that everything one sees may not be what it appears to be! I too have been taking the FCLO / FSLO since 2008 and in doses of 4 teaspoons a day (2 Cod and 2 Skate) for the past 5 years as of this month. At almost 67 years of age, I do house painting full time year round, retail sell the FCLO products nightly, and try to do at least one show with the FCLO monthly. This has been my schedule for the past 5 years selling the ‘oil’, which I plan to continue to take daily. I have numerous loyal customers, most of whom I have personally met, and I will honor the decisions they may make about the FCLO either way – but realize that some times a quick rush to judgement decision may not be the ultimate best one. Dr. Daniel refers to Sally Fallon Morell by name only in the opening paragraph of her 100 plus page E book. Dr. Daniel does not mention that Sally is the current Presdient of the WAPF until mid way through the E Book. I feel that Dr. Daniel showed a complete lack of respect for Sally Fallon Morell in doing this. What point is she trying to make? Is Dr. Daniel taking the WAPF Board of Directors decision not to test the FCLO personally? An investigation should be simply a reporting of ‘the facts’. I feel strongly from an ethical point that Dr. Daniel should resign as VP of the WAPF and if she doesn’t take that step on her own, the WAPF Board of Directors should so move the question! In closing, it should be noted that Dr. Daniel’s extensive detailed ‘investigative’ report says nothing about contacting the so named guilty party – Green Pasture Products- to ascertain ‘all the facts’. We do live in America not Russia, where ‘Naughty’ might be accepted. Tks for reading my sincere thoughts. JOHN

    August 24th, 2015 10:46 am Reply
    • Martha

      John, I figured you would say what you did. Will you buy back all the Green Pasture products I bought from you? I spent a fortune and it all went into your pocket and Green Pasture.

      August 25th, 2015 7:37 pm Reply
  • Chef Lynda

    Kayyla Daniel’s really stuck her neck out, this was a huge personal sacrifice and I for one am truly grateful for her findings!!! Thank you Kayyla for showing us HOW BIG YOUR BRAVE IS!!

    I am sickened by this because we have been taking FCLO daily for over 10 years. Last year we caught every virus that was going around, including the flu. One would think we were licking the grocery cart handles and all other public surfaces. NOW I think I understand; we are probably very low in D3 – according to the reports this is what happens. We are OFF ALL GREEN PASTURES products until further studies. Why on earth would we continue to use something that MAY have toxic vegetable oil in it? Decayed Pollock Liver/Toxic Vegetable Oil? I don’t think so!

    August 24th, 2015 10:43 am Reply
  • Julie

    Thanks for this post. After waiting a few years to finally be able to afford to purchase and begin taking these products I will be following this information closely.I haven’t been taking these products for very long to be able to report any significant health changes but I’ve been hopeful.

    August 24th, 2015 10:42 am Reply
  • Michelle

    I for one have not been helped by the FCLO since I began taking it in 2009. I had blood work done in 2010 and my Vitamin D level was 25. This April I had blood work done again because my teeth were becoming translucent and I was wondering if I was not absorbing calcium. My Vitamin D level came back and it is currently 21. All of my other numbers are fine. I believe if I hadn’t been getting sunlight, a minimum of 30 minutes whenever it is sunny, then my level would be far worse. I have been working with a nutritionist to try and correct this. I have been on a high dose liquid Vitamin D 3 and my teeth are no longer translucent. I have been a WAPF member since 2006 and I really hope they and Green Pastures are what they say they are. I will not be consuming Green Pastures product as it does not work for me. I will be retesting my levels at years end.

    August 24th, 2015 10:42 am Reply
  • Lynn

    I am concerned that you are not taking Dr. Daniels report more seriously. You state that Dr. Schmid’s claims are not scientific (n=1) while at the same time using your own family’s results to bolster your feelings that FCLO is good. Both anecdotal. I took it for over a year and ended up with toxic levels of Vitamin A and a constant low reading of my Vitamin D levels. In the same period I was giving the FCLO to my husband, he ended up with Afib and surgery to correct it along with other symptoms affecting his vascular system that did not go away until we stopped FCLO. All anecdotal to be sure but I don’t think you should dismiss Dr. Daniels claims yet and I do think you should tone down the stab at her blog name. It comes across like you are demeaning her credentials by pointing out the silliness of her blog name. Maybe not, just makes you look petty.

    August 24th, 2015 10:30 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      I don’t take a “report” that has personal digs throughout and doesn’t name the labs used so these people can be contacted directly to verify the authenticity of the data and testing to be anything that should be taken seriously at least not yet until full disclosure and transparency are provided.

      August 24th, 2015 11:07 am Reply
      • Skye

        I agree it is suspect that labs are but named. Where can we see the labs WAPF had done? I don’t see those named either.

        August 24th, 2015 12:38 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          Here’s they are completely transparent and identified. This was published in February 2015. http://www.westonaprice.org/uncategorized/concerns-about-fermented-cod-liver-oil/

          August 24th, 2015 12:44 pm Reply
          • MS

            Hi Sarah, thanks for this post. The Daniels report definitely raises some questions as it seems to be tied up with marketing for her coaching practice (you have to sign up for her list to get it; she offers free sessions which no doubt will point you towards her coaching, etc.) I don’t have a problem with people marketing their services but they do paint the report in a different light.

            A question: MidWestern Laboratories, the lab referenced in the link you posted above, doesn’t show up on a google search, and I’m curious that their site wasn’t hyperlinked. Is it this company? midwestlabs.com/

            August 24th, 2015 7:18 pm
      • denise

        I ordered FCLO & Bio-Kult because it was recommended for the GAPS diet, having just received my first order today. Seeing this info is quite upsetting. I am just a lay person who is putting my trust in someone else. I don’t know if I should take these products or not. :-(

        September 4th, 2015 11:05 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          Hi Denise, I’ve been taking BioKult and FCLO for many, many years along with my husband and children. They have proven to be wonderful supplements that we have relied on to help keep us well and they have delivered exactly as promised. I would recommend if you are concerned to have your holistic practitioner do a muscle test on you for each product. This will alleviate any fears you may have!

          September 5th, 2015 8:56 am Reply
    • Barbara

      I find your comment about Daniel’s blog name interesting, given the comment that Sarah made above is exactly what Kaayla herself encouraged when she “rebranded” herself as the Naughty Nutritionist a few years ago. Although she always gets a few laughs when she speaks now, I had to stop getting her blog feed, stopped following her on FB, and prefer not to attend her sessions at the conference any more since the sexual innuendo is so often over the top that it trivializes whatever topic she is discussing.

      As for someone making unwarranted demeaning digs at people, one need only look at Daniel’s most recent report.

      August 24th, 2015 12:10 pm Reply
  • Three Pipe Problem

    The report states that the WAPF board voted not to test the FCLO after questions had been raised. Would you be willing to share at some point how you voted on that and why?

    August 24th, 2015 10:23 am Reply
    • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

      Correction to your statement … the WAPF had ALREADY tested the FCLO when the vote was taken. The Board voted not to do *additional* testing as the testing that had already been done indicated zero problems with rancidity.

      All non profit minutes are open to the public and have to be shared whenever requested. So, yes, I can say how I voted … it was 7-1 and I voted with the majority not to conduct additional testing as the testing that had been done was sufficient.

      August 24th, 2015 5:30 pm Reply
      • Three Pipe Problem

        Thanks!

        There is so much to process here. I gather Dr. Daniels was critical of the earlier research but it’s hard for me to know how to evaluate her criticisms in this respect.

        As to the blanking out of the labs, what if this was part of an internal “blind” within Dr. Daniel’s process? i.e. what if it was blanked out so she didn’t know which lab was which during her analysis. This is the only reason I can think of for redacting the info.

        I suppose Dr. Daniels is the next move — if the labs are revealed and they are reputable ones, wouldn’t it obviate a lot of what has been said here?

        August 25th, 2015 12:30 pm Reply
        • Three Pipe Problem

          Dr. Daniels has posted an article stating that the requirement to withhold identity of labs is a standard practice. Chris Kresser published an article today in which he makes the same point. It seems this criticism is a red herring, although I would like to see further corroboration of Daniels and Kresser’s position. Also the lab name is hidden in some of Green Pastures own published results.

          This seems to place the WAPF board and some of the defenders here in an awkward position, as much of the defense relies on the premise that this practice is anomalous, when it’s industry standard.

          I could be missing something but it also seems to me that the detailed criticism of the earlier-funded WAPF tests hasn’t been adequately responded to here, although Kresser’s article does so — and moderated the concerns somewhat. But no entirely, from my perspective. Did Dr. Daniels make these criticisms of the earlier testing to the WAPF board?

          Regardless of where the details fall, I’ve seen enough to believe that WAPF’s close financial relationship with a major vendor has clouded the issue. I think the correct thing to do for WAPF is to conduct it’s own testing *and* to change the relationship of its financial partnerships to avoid future conflicts of interest.

          August 26th, 2015 12:29 pm Reply
      • Steve Tallent

        Apparently the above statement is not accurate. I requested the board meeting minutes the day that you posted this comment. A week later I commented on that WAPF page that I had requested the minutes and received no response. Next day I called to ask what I needed to do to get a copy of the meeting minutes. What followed next was one of the strangest conversations I have ever had. The girl said, “Let me check.” Came back within a minute and said, “Yes, we got your request and it was forwarded yesterday.” This was a strange response as I hadn’t given my name. I asked if there was any timeline for an answer. “I don’t know.” Where was the request forwarded? “I don’t know.” The tone on the other end was very cold, and obviously very curt. I ended the call. Today, I get a message from Sally:

        “Hi Steve,

        Sorry for the delay in answering

        It is the policy of the Weston A. Price Foundation to not make the minutes of meetings of its board of directors public. We have found that a policy of confidentiality supports full and frank discussions by the board.

        We have consulted with our legal counsel and have been advised that this policy is in accordance with applicable law.

        Sincerely, Sally”

        I can’t help but think that if that was actually “the policy” prior to today, that it would take a week and a half to get back to me or that an intern wouldn’t have been able to handle the reply. Instead the director had to handle the matter personally, making it seem like this is either new, or abnormal. But apparently, if not before, at least now that is the policy. Still wondering what went down in that meeting that would lead to Kaayla Daniel acting as she did.

        September 2nd, 2015 10:15 pm Reply
        • Sarah TheHealthyHomeEconomist

          I was originally under the impression that the minutes could be shared, but then our attorney said that it was not required. I apologize for the confusion on that point. Having been at that meeting (I actually write the minutes myself), I can assure you that nothing “went down” to cause Dr. Daniel to go rogue as she has. It was a simple discussion and the vote was 7-1 that the independent testing the WAPF had already done on the fermented cod liver oil was sufficient and demonstrated no grounds for Dr. Daniel’s rancidity concerns. Dr. Masterjohn’s rebuttal of Dr. Daniel’s report I think clearly explains the huge problems with it from a lipid scientist’s perspective. I encourage you to read his write-up if you haven’t already. http://blog.cholesterol-and-health.com/2015/08/weighing-in-on-fermented-cod-liver-oil.html

          If you are still concerned, just go and have your practitioner do a muscle test on you with the fermented cod liver oil. That’s what I’ve done .. it tested fine and I’m continuing to use it as I always have for the past 9 years.

          September 2nd, 2015 10:37 pm Reply
  • Karen

    Who funded the tests you refer to in your bullet point “Green Pasture Product’s fermented cod liver oil has been tested by two independent labs – one in the USA and in the UK – and found to be free of rancidity while containing valuable nutrients. These tests served as the basis for the WAPF Board deciding in 2014 that claims of rancidity were unfounded.”

    August 24th, 2015 10:19 am Reply
  • Ashley

    Sarah, thank you for your balanced, cautious approach to this delicate situation. I, too, will be waiting to see how this all plays out before making changes. I do feel this is something anyone taking this product should follow, but knee-jerk reactions do not help anyone!

    August 24th, 2015 9:16 am Reply
    • plum

      Ashley, I favour this stance too.

      From experience I can say that taking this as part of a tooth healing regime (à la Rami Nagel) produced astounding results. I cannot possibly determine how integral it was to this end but I can say the changes I made worked. These days I rely much less on supplements, more on foods themselves but I was considering a Winter top-up of FCLO…

      Thank you Sarah. I shall follow this with interest.

      August 24th, 2015 1:23 pm Reply
  • Sara

    I am more concerned with the low purported vitamin content and the mislabeled “cod”. I do wonder why the labs weren’t disclosed. This whole thing is a mess. I do think that Dave isn’t very transparent and I would love to know how fat and protein can be fermented.

    August 24th, 2015 8:08 am Reply
    • Erin

      This is just how I feel. I still have a lot of questions. As somebody who is hoping and trying to get pregnant, I really want hard answers. I feel like if it might have trans fats, be rancid, etc, then why should I take the risk when I have had three successful pregnancies and births in the past when I was not taking any variety of clo at all.

      August 24th, 2015 6:56 pm Reply
  • Maja

    I feel so strange about it as we have been taken fclo since last year. I have very sensitive teeth and still one healing tooth decay. If i dont take fclo and eat a little to much grains or some natural sweetener my toothache is back. The minute I take it ,within few minutes the pain is gone. I am so sensitive that I know thru my teeth if the chicken was grain feed or pasture raised as my teeth give me trouble .Just have to wait and see as I have meet Sally on the conference in Ireland and I doubt she will leave all this without explanations. Hope its all false as i felt in love with that product.

    August 24th, 2015 7:55 am Reply
    • dina

      Maja, same here! I also get a tooth ache/sensitive teeth from too many/too often grains/sweetener/fruit and instant relief from ache/sensitivity as soon as I take GP’s FCLO. I also used to get regular cavities/dental issues at each check up despite OCD levels of dental hygeine but as soon as I started taking FCLO they all stopped. Havent had a single one in the 4 years I’ve been taking it.

      August 24th, 2015 1:06 pm Reply
    • Victor

      Same here. The Green Pasture products work like magic on my teeth. I’ve settled on the infused coconut oil, and have had the same great results from several different ways of using their FCLO and Butter Oil combo.

      The report from Dr. Daniel is obviously bogus. There are countless people – both professional and lay persons – that have indisputable first hand experience. And you can find so many of these experiences published on the Internet, and in books, singing the praises of Green Pasture and Dave Wetzel. Their products are hands down the best in the world in the category. Globally, they are THE choice by the best distributors. And yet they remain small enough to stay remain uncorrupted.

      Furthermore, Dave is very approachable and forthcoming, and the amount of information on the website is incredible. There is no producer that I trust more.

      With all that being said, people should keep in mind that results vary wildly across people, as everyone has different body chemistry, and even for an individual, results will vary over time, as there is so much that influences our individual body chemistry.

      Dr. Daniel’s report should be completely disregarded, as it is baseless, and nothing more than an attempt to gain attention in that market.

      August 25th, 2015 10:09 am Reply
  • Isabel Natrins

    It is of equal (if not greater) concern that a senior figure in the WAPF has undertaken this research and has taken the step of publishing this damaging report. She cannot have taken this step lightly and without due consideration of its impact. We are all eagerly awaiting Green Pasture’s and WAPF’s response, but there is clearly much more to this situation than disagreement on the definitions of ‘fermentation’ and ‘rancidity’.

    August 24th, 2015 3:48 am Reply
    • Caitlin

      Except, she did so autonomously and is NOT being transparent. My family has been taking this product for years. We have experienced amazing health regeneration. It has had beautiful benefits that I have not experienced with many different fish oils over the last 15 years of trying different ones. The proof is in the pudding.

      I also concur with the eyebrow raising at taking mega doses of anything, with the fish oil expressly. You can take too much of a good thing.

      August 24th, 2015 8:00 am Reply
    • Valerie

      There already is a response from Green Pasture. Here it is below. I agree with Sarah’s thoughts on this. I’m not making any changes until more factual information is released. link:http://www.greenpasture.org/fermented-cod-liver-oil-butter-oil-vitamin-d-vitamin-a/response-to-questions-on-fermented-cod-liver-oil/

      August 24th, 2015 4:31 pm Reply

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